ENERGY
A.J.E.W. I am thinking of the assembly as the great area of activity in life and power. We know on the one hand that the walk and way of the Lord Jesus were marked by intense activity, so that John speaks with very manifest feeling of the things that Jesus did: not only that He spoke or was to be seen of men but He did things, a great variety of things in the infinite perfectness of His manhood and the glory of His Person. And when He went into heaven and the Spirit came we have an immediate course of energetic and committed activity bringing evidence of life in the disciples, and as the history unfolds in the Acts and Paul comes on to view in a prominent way we have the Lord intimating to him that he was to be ready at once for active labour. The course of the Pauline service which is before us in the history in the Acts and is then evident in his epistles is full of the energetic pursuit and application of the truth. It struck me that this chapter gives us certain active ideas which are related to the assembly, especially the local assembly. Various matters are touched on from the eighth verse onwards, and we have the gifts touched on from the twenty-eighth verse onwards, and a great basis for the whole active function of matters in the assembly to proceed through the Spirit so that the divine ends in His beloved saints are reached. I get an impression that the Lord is looking to us for the energetic application of His mind which is really the character of what is Pauline. We often speak of the revival, as we may refer to it, being very distinctly connected with the Pauline truths but we would see it related I believe not only to the Pauline teaching but to the Pauline energy in love for Christ which he continually manifested. The great scope of his untiring service touched on in different places is to bear upon us in a peculiarly stimulating manner that at the end, as the Lord is about to come, there may be the energetic pursuit in the Spirit of what is yielding in its preciousness for Himself. It is of deep interest that this chapter begins by its reference to the divine operations, what God is doing, reminding us that He is the author of what is carried through, and yet He uses His servants, He fits them to be employed as He may please; everything is of Him, and it may stimulate us to get some little impression of the operations of God proceeding quickly and decisively at the end.
A.B.P. They are sufficiently diversified so that we need not get in one another's way. I was thinking of the list of things; but then the working out of it in body activity is also diversified.
A.J.E.W. Hence the body is brought in not so much by reference to its head - I suppose there is a certain reference to Christ as the Head in the twelfth verse "so also is the Christ" referring to the whole anointed order of things in the assembly - but the body is presented as the wonderful organism in which the Spirit of God is active. It reminds us of our links with one another and our labour in relation to one another and as you say, we do not get in one another's way. The sensitiveness to the one Spirit and a due sensitiveness to what is going on in a wider setting is implied in what is set out here, that we have this remarkable entity, the body, in view.
A.B.P. Do we have a suggestion in John 12 of how it works out? We may be tested because of being few in numbers and much to be done, but each seemed to be in the proper setting in the body in John 12 that just provided what was needed for the whole occasion but without any interference one with an other.
A.J.E.W. Which part of John 12 are you referring to?
A.B.P. I was thinking of how Mary was at the feet of Jesus and that Martha served and that Lazarus was one of those who sat at table with Him. These were three distinctive areas of feeling and function.
A.J.E.W. They are indeed; and of course the relations between them would be very close, very affectionate and feeling relations because they had richly experienced the compassion and activity and power of Jesus. Well, as we gather, brothers and sisters, we are all in that position, we are brought into sensitive inter-relationships with one another, having been secured on the ground of His finished work and having proved the surpassing blessedness of the gift of the Spirit. I thought the sensitive side of things in life in the body becomes very attractive and a basis for every activity, and there are many activities that are necessary that love for Christ would energetically undertake, but all is under control, every part is in its due place because the body is in view.
G.D.W. Would it be of interest that in Paul's great chapter on serviceability where energy is necessary (I am referring to the second chapter of 2 Timothy), we need to have a judgment of the great house of Christendom so that there is a separating of the vessels to honour in view of service? Then the great amount of energy; "pursue righteousness, faith, love, peace, with those that call upon the Lord out of a pure heart" (v 22). Would this not give a basis in these days of breakdown so that we can act in the light of what we have in this chapter in Corinthians?
A.J.E.W. I think that is so. The very idea of pursuing righteousness, faith, love and peace is an indication that this is not just a set of governing principles but it is something that is being pursued as a definite, vital object in the maintenance of what is precious to Christ. The later verses in that epistle, in chapter 4, are very appropriate to what you are saying; "be urgent in season and out of season, convict, rebuke, encourage, with all longsuffering" (v 2). Then he goes on to speak of combating the good combat and having finished the race. These are all suggestions which are stimulating to energetic application of things. I believe there is a need of this, a realising among us of the greatness of that to which we stand committed. I could not help being struck today, to refer to it in passing; with the word that Nehemiah used in chapter 6 of his book when Sanballat and Tobijah and the others came to spoil the building of the wall; he replies "I am doing a great work, and I cannot come down. Why should the work cease, whilst I leave it and come down to you?" (v 3), showing how in days that correspond with the chapter you quote in 2 Timothy there was the unswerving pursuit of what we might speak of as the main point of the moment, and a readiness to resist every effort to divert it in view of spoiling what is for God.
G.D.W. One thing necessary in pursuit physically is for the body to be functioning and we must have the right objective - the four things that are mentioned. Otherwise we might tend to shy away from the combat that is mentioned in the fourth chapter of that epistle.
C.S.E. At the Supper the loaf brings very forcefully before us the thought of one body. We sometimes sing, 'The bread reminds us we are one, One body there is seen' (hymn 430). Would you help us in the development of appreciation of the thought of the body.
A.J.E.W. Chapter 12 following the reference to the Lord's supper in chapter 11 is very suggestive, as if, as the Supper has its bearing upon us and its effect in love in us, we are rendered ready for the course of needed activity which chapter 12 involves, but not without the idea of the body being brought in. In reading through the chapter as a whole the remarkable emphasis that the writer gives to the functioning of things body-wise is very noticeable, the emphasis on the presence of the different members and the service and function that is distinctive to each, and the necessity for each and all to be in function. So that the body, as Mr Ware was suggesting, is thriving in what you could speak of as a healthy state; there is nothing disjointed but a movement together in life and in power.
C.S.E. It says "if one member suffer"; if one member is impaired, then the entire organism is somewhat affected, and until the process of repair, so to speak, is set in motion and the member is brought back into function there would be something of the body thought missing.
A.J.E.W. Yes. Of course the place that the Holy Spirit has, emphasised in the beginning of the chapter, is to be taken great note of: "no one, speaking in the power of the Spirit of God, says, Curse on Jesus; and no one can say, Lord Jesus, unless in the power of the Holy Spirit". It is as if the basic necessity for recognition of the Spirit is emphasised, and that comes into the different functions that are mentioned. "There are distinctions of gifts, but the same Spirit; and there are distinctions of services, and the same Lord; and there are distinctions of operations, but the same God who operates all things in all"; that is, we are not working at our own matters, the body is not seeking exactly its own increase; the question is what is going forward for the divine pleasure and that in which God in His wonderfully active operations is proceeding. It becomes a challenge whether we can locate the operations of God in their blessedness at any time. Do we have some grasp through the Spirit's direction of what God is doing, speaking simply, at this present moment?
C.S.E. Would the Spirit be the power by which the connection between the members is maintained?
A.J.E.W. It is most attractive. We see how that is spelled out in detail for us in verse 8; "For to one, by the Spirit, is given the word of wisdom; and to another the word of knowledge, according to the same Spirit; and to a different one faith, in the power of the same Spirit; and to another gifts of healing in the power of the same Spirit". The strong emphasis on these points in the chapter is particularly to be noticed, and the necessity for the blessed Spirit of God to have His place in every functioning of things that goes on for God's pleasure.
A.M. I was wondering if that is vital so that nothing is damaged. We were noticing in Samuel how there were those who did great damage because they were not under control.
A.J.E.W. I think that is a very vital point. It is a very challenging point too. But the challenge that the Spirit of God brings in a scripture like this is never to quench the resolve of devotion to Christ to answer to what the chapter presents. I believe the stimulating touch of this chapter is to affect us tonight; so that, as you say, nothing is damaged. There is a sensitiveness in God's work, especially, speaking simply, in young persons and it is not difficult to damage them, and we long that we may never damage them, that there may be nothing afoot that would damage them, but rather the right coordinated functioning of everything in the Spirit. So that the activity that marks the assembly takes on a distinctive character which is according to God. It is not just so many persons together all speaking at once or with different objectives or with different means of reaching the objectives, but something that is united into one by this emphasis on the same Spirit, which I believe would greatly stimulate and affect us.
G.D.W. By the assembly you mean of course what is mentioned in some translations as the church. It is the assembly of Christ on earth as it is today; we do not know every member of it and it is obscure to some degree but then we can act in the light of it.
A.J.E.W. It is important to get that point, that we seek, as helped of God - we could never do it without that help - to move in the light of what the assembly, the church, is according to the divine thoughts and according to the very extensive teaching that the Spirit of God has given us especially in the Pauline instruction.
G.D.W. Does that give us body feeling and affection for every member of the body?
A.J.E.W. Quite so. And it also would raise the question of the unfailing, vigorous pursuit of the divine objectives, which was the feature of Pauline service referred to in a number of ways in a number of places. I fear a certain slipping back into what we could speak of - I do not say that to reflect upon anything or anyone - as an easy Christianity, when the Spirit of God would really stir us up to something which is to match the glory of the end of this time of the Spirit even as there was something of like glory as this time of the Spirit began.
A.B.P. So if there is any feeling with us that these things are too great for us it would stimulate us to desire gift.
A.J.E.W. I am glad you bring that in because we do not desire gift to make anything of ourselves. It would be a very poor thing if we sought gift to make something of ourselves. But if we desire gift for the sake of what God is effecting among those who love Him, what God is effecting among men as the word is preached, and every aspect of His work, if we desire the greater gifts in view of prospering that, how pleasing it is to Him to answer the desire.
A.B.P. It would seem that Paul has prophecy as the top-stone of that, which, speaking simply, would be to be near enough to the divine presence to be able to get God's mind as to conditions, would it?
A.J.E.W. Yes, I am sure. And in getting God's mind as to the conditions, to find from Him the grace to apply one's self to the conditions in a positive sense. We would recall, as you speak of such things, the way in which a man like Elisha applied himself in prophetic power to the case of the dead boy. He got into the closest contact with him and imparted something to him in the sense of life and vigour. It is often that which tests us; we may find grace to get up and give a word, and it is right that a word be given in the meeting appropriate to it, but have we the power to carry things through, to make effective what the mind of God is disclosed to be? It is that that becomes the deep challenge, and yet it is a challenge the Spirit of God would give us grace to face and to come through.
G.D.W. Some of the gifts are not what you might call spectacular; a shepherd is moving in an area where only heaven may know what he is doing. But there is a need of carrying, and it is not always the most pleasant kind of work, but you are working with a soul trying to bring them back into the fold into the sense of the one flock. Is that not one of the offsets to this easy-going Christianity which is really just a way of coasting without really functioning?
A.J.E.W. I believe that is so. Of course the tenderness of the shepherd is greatly to be coveted. A shepherd is tender without in any sense sacrificing his charge. He would be vigorous in repelling the attack on the sheep or the lamb that he tends, and yet the tender ness of his tending is there all the time.
G.D.W. He can deal with the lion and the bear but he can lift the lamb on his shoulders.
A.J.E.W. Precisely. In the setting of these things in the body - you get first what God set there and then what God has set in the assembly: setting certain in the assembly - we are made to see that it is His matter and yet it has in view an immense area of activity which is of Him, which is linked with His own operations; indeed it expresses and carries through His own operations. It is wonderful to think of the body as divinely usable in such a variety of ways to a variety of ends which glorify the God who has set everything there that is in function.
B.T. I was thinking of the energy that marks these cults and results in damage. It might link with verse 2, "led away to dumb idols, in whatever way ye might be led", and there is the demon behind the idol. The Corinthians were probably glad to be delivered from that but at the same time there was a tendency to drop into lethargy as you were saying, not active in the body as we should be.
A.J.E.W. I believe it is good to see that. You cannot but think of the general scope and character of this letter, the conditions that the apostle actually faced in Corinth as he wrote, but he went right through with the whole matter, bringing forward teaching of the most searching and yet of the most positive kind to reach an end among them that would be according to God. You marvel at the patience and resoluteness of a beloved servant who could write two letters like these, faced as he was with very dark conditions in that locality, and yet he went through with the matter. It is just to remind us of the necessity for energetic application of the truth when we are in the presence of departure of any kind as we are in these days in which we live, where the departure is general and where the thoughts of God are going through on the basis of the energetic maintenance and application of the truth; under control, not in any free-lance manner but under the wonderful regulating touch of the Spirit of God and in the sensitiveness of relations which mark the body.
L.MacF. So the spirit of fatherhood in a locality is very important. Paul said "not many fathers", 1 Cor 4: 15. So the promotion of liberty and brethren taking on their responsibility would be enhanced, do you think?
A.J.E.W. I do indeed. That is a feeling touch: "not many fathers". What a father he was among his brethren, among the people of God! What a fatherly touch there always was with Paul! Not that he would shrink from faithfulness as to any element of evil or of the world that was there; he would not shrink from having to say to that in the most definite terms, but what a father he was! And we need the fathers. Some of us are getting a little bit up in years and we are feeling the challenge of the need of fathers in our time, whether we can take on fatherhood in reference to these things.
G.D.W. Does not the father want every member of the family to be functioning and happy, whatever service or office the other members of the family have? It is not the idea of what is sometimes spoken of as clericalism, where everything is left just to one man, but the principle of getting every member of the body functioning. It is not as in verse 17: "if the whole body were an eye"; that would be a rather limited view of things; but to be able to sit down as brethren with every one functioning under the leadership of the Spirit.
A.J.E.W. That is right. And of course the leadership of the Spirit is the prime point in what you are saying, because it is not that a man is directing this or that or something else; it calls into play the felt need on our side of continual relation with the Spirit to get His mind about things and to speak and to serve and to act in His power.
G.D.P. So it says in verse 11, as the Spirit pleases, and then we are baptised by one Spirit into one body. I was thinking about what you said as to our relations with the Spirit and being kept in that relationship consciously.
A.J.E.W. We are not arranging things. These are not our activities. It is a question of what God is doing, what the Spirit of God is doing and the place that in grace and yet in power He may give to those with whom He is in liberty to take on the things that need to be done. There is a great deal that needs to be done and a great deal of the precious truths unfolded and established from Scripture and set out for us in a form which helps us to assimilate it. What an immense volume of the mind of God in the truth is available to us and we need to apply ourselves to it. To have it in the bookcase is not enough in these days; we need to apply ourselves to these things. It takes time, it takes sacrifice, it takes resolve, how we use our time and so forth, and that we do not fritter it away on things which have no real positive relation to the divine interests.
A.S.H. Would verse 7 - "But to each the manifestation of the Spirit is given for profit" - signify that anything that may be manifested to us by the Spirit, and we go in for it wholeheartedly, would yield profit and gain not only for ourselves but also for others?
A.J.E.W. The great end in mind in God's assembly is always profit. It is never loss, it is never damage; if damage comes in - and the word damage was used earlier - it is because man has had a place somewhere; the whole activity of the Spirit of God is for profit. Christianity is a glorious positive matter from start to finish. The dispensation in which we are, this time of the Spirit, is full of the most positive possibilities of power and strengthening and the developing of what is according to God for the satisfaction of His heart. We need sometimes just to get a sense of the immense positiveness of that to which our God has called us and to watch that nothing allows our minds to be running continually in negative channels, because we can get over - occupied with negative things.
C.S.E. I was affected by the word 'set' in verse 28: "God has set certain in the assembly"; I thought there is great power in that word. It is God's doing. Do I have the sense that God has placed me in the assembly for a purpose? If I have that sense, then I will seek to guard my place rightly because He has a purpose in putting me there. Do you think it is in view that He might get greater glory?
A.J.E.W. The word 'set', you mean, involves, as the note explains, that He has set for Himself; that is, the return is to be to Him, the glory is to be to Him. You feel that the chapter is intended in that way to help us to cherish the divine thoughts for His own satisfaction. We are not here for our own pleasure - how much God does give us which is delightful to a heart true to Christ! what blessing we experience! what times of profit and refreshment and enlargement! - yet the glory of it all is to be His.
C.S.E. It makes us think of God's infinite skill and wisdom in taking up one and another and setting us among nobles and princes, dignifying persons, giving them the Holy Spirit and causing them to act comelily. There would be a right co-ordination as the members of the body function in that comely way. Do you think that is normal?
A.J.E.W. God has, if I could use a simple word, immense investment in the assembly. You will remember how Mr Taylor used to remind us of the gifts as being an element of adornment so that something should appear in peculiarly choice and distinct character. What is in view here is nothing ordinary or commonplace but what is adorned and according to God for His own satisfaction. A true lover would cherish that, that God has what answers in this sense to His own heart.
S.E.H. In Nehemiah, where persons are repairing the wall, it says several times "next to them repaired"; and then there are persons who have responsibility for different gates, each person, as Mr Elliott says, is set and has a responsibility for repairing or building some part of the wall.
A.J.E.W. The wall was successfully completed against the opposition and ridicule that it occasioned; it is of great moment to bring that in because it was a time of recovery within a recovery; that is to say, the main process of things under Ezra had shown, alas, a certain loss of momentum, but Nehemiah coming into the scene restores momentum to the great matter that was proceeding. I believe there is an element of need of that at the present time; God has done much in His faithfulness to His saints and to His own thoughts by way of recovery and yet there is always the tendency, which is frequently seen in scriptural history, for the momentum to be lost. God would stimulate us by His word that there may be no loss of momentum; we are to move on. There is much to be done and it may be that there are few available to do it; therefore it is the more urgent that every one be available to do it and to pursue what is necessary with the energy that God delights to supply and to support.
C.C.G. "God has tempered the body together, having given more abundant honour to the part that lacked". What do you say about that?
A.J.E.W. The sovereign touch is there. He may give what seems a more prominent place to certain ones, and yet every one is needed, He has tempered it together. He has entered feelingly into the constitution of it. There is nothing formal or automatic about this; God has entered into the matter so that all that relates to the body is such as He can find pleasure in. To have some sense of an active place and part in such an organism is to stimulate us increasingly. Of course the glorious Head is Christ. The anointed order of things that is spoken of, "so also is the Christ", is the whole matter of Christ the glorious Head related to His assembly as the body. To get a view of that will often transform our objectives, clarify them to get us to see what the Spirit of God would have us to do.
C.C.G. Is our place to be subject to His teaching?
A.J.E.W. Quite so.
NEW YORK
21 November 1978
Key to initials
C.S.Elliott; C.C.Gill; A.S.Hinkson; S.E.Hesterman, Plainfield; A.Macdonald, Plainfield; MacFarlane; A.B.Parker; G.D.Pfingst; B.Taylor; A.J.E.Welch, London; G.D.Ware
(All local except where otherwise stated)