THE CROSS (3)
John 19:25-30; Hebrews 13:10-14
A.M. In our readings yesterday, we were occupied with the cross of Jesus. I might just say that, when we speak of the cross, what is filling our hearts is the blessed One who was there. It is the Lord Jesus Himself, and yesterday we were occupied with Him. In the first reading, we considered the moral excellence of the One who suffered there, the Man who was able to glorify God and give Him honour in a scene of such darkness and wickedness. Then in the second reading, we looked at the Lord Jesus as the One who had the capacity to bear all that was laid upon Him – the fire, the divine testing and proving. We considered the brazen serpent and then the brazen altar and how the fire was sustained. Then our dear brother gave us a word in the address on the need for maintaining and building what belongs to the testimony and the various aspects of the wall of Jerusalem and the gates.
Today we should look at how the cross of Jesus bears on the public testimony. We have this wonderful reference by John: there were those who were standing “by the cross of Jesus”. Matthew, Mark and Luke give us the Lord Jesus as alone, and the women are presented as afar off. None were there, you might say, in close association with Him; they were afar off. He went through alone in the greatness of His moral worth and the greatness of all that He was able to bear. In those gospels, He is seen as alone. But in John we get a different aspect. In John’s gospel, the Lord Jesus is in control. Even upon the cross, He is in control of everything. We see that in the way in which He speaks on the cross; He is ordering things, and it is in view of what continues. The pathway of Jesus did not terminate at the cross in John’s gospel; there is what continues, and what goes through: “And by the cross of Jesus stood his mother, and the sister of his mother”. John mentions these dear women but he does not say that he was there, although we know that he was. In that sense, he was giving the credit to the weakest as if he would say, ‘These dear souls are identified with the cross of Jesus’. The Lord takes account of them there and He orders things, even in relation to what is natural. Everything is according to His word, even to the giving up of His life.
In Hebrews we have reference to the day of atonement, alluding to Leviticus 16 which we read yesterday where the bullock was slain and its blood was brought into the holy of holies. But the bullock was burned outside the camp. Although the blood was brought in, the victim was burned outside the camp, and the writer of Hebrews says, “Wherefore also Jesus, that he might sanctify the people by his own blood, suffered without the gate:”, and then the appeal comes, “therefore let us go forth to him”. The cross is a point of distinction, our point of severance, as we sometimes sing:-
‘By love constrained, Thy death we deem
Our point of severance from this scene’. (Hymn 192)
That is what the cross is in John’s gospel, ‘our point of severance’, and the writer of Hebrews says: “therefore let us go forth to him”. Where are we going?
I thought we should look at Corinthians because there we see how Paul, as having gone through this terrible, corrupt and idolatrous city, and having received a word from the Lord that He had much people in that city (Acts 18:10), begins at the cross: “but we preach Christ crucified”. Paul also says, “For I did not judge it well to know anything among you save Jesus Christ, and him crucified”. This was the entrance; this was the beginning of a company, the beginning of assembly life and assembly experience for those he wrote to. Not only are they separated, the cross coming as a point of demarcation between the world and the believer; but the cross stands as the point where believers in their experience can begin to enter into what is of assembly character.
N.J.H. I think that is very helpful. Do you view these persons standing by the cross as assembly personnel?
A.M. Yes, it seems to me they are a kind of embryo. Later we get the one hundred and twenty, but here there is a nucleus.
N.J.H. So the cross has a bearing on our spiritual and moral relations together.
A.M. Yes, indeed. These people were not there purely because they were related. John mentions their relationships, but Mary was there because she was drawn to Christ. And the two other Marys, why were they there? They had been drawn to Jesus. That is the basis of our links together. They supersede any other links.
P.J.W. You have spoken of what is public. I wonder if we must remember Paul’s word as to “the scandal of the cross”, Gal.5:11. In the world, the cross is sometimes used as an ornament, as jewellery, but Paul says it is a “scandal”. Were these persons prepared to accept that?
A.M. That is right. They were fully identified with the Lord Jesus there upon the cross. In one account in the gospels it says that “the soldiers also made game of him” (Luke 23:36), as if in His humiliation He could be a subject of entertainment to people. How wicked the heart of man is! But these dear souls who stood by the cross said in principle, ‘This Man means everything to us. We are going to be identified with Him here’.
P.J.W. I have often thought – who would give vinegar to a dying man to drink? That is what the world did.
A.M. Yes, indeed; what heartlessness! Every feature of man’s heart was exposed there, but there was a distinction – there were those who, as it were, said, ‘We are going to be true to this Man’.
R.D.P. I was thinking about what you said earlier, and it is very affecting, that the bullock was burned outside the camp. It was, we may say, a part of the execution that they had that was distasteful to them. They burned the bodies outside, and that in principle is where these women stood.
A.M. That is right. The body of the bullock that was burnt nevertheless had to be without spot and without blemish. It had to be absolutely perfect and yet it was taken out and it was burned. There is really the end of a whole order of man. Jesus was perfect in flesh and blood, the only man that there has ever been who was absolutely perfect in flesh and blood, but He “suffered without the gate”, and the cross stands here as a great point of severance.
J.L. Can you say something about your thoughts in regard of standing by the cross?
A.M. Was that deliberate, that they took up that position? It was not casual. They were deliberately taking up a position here. There were those who were passing by and there were those who sat down in indifference, but there were those women who in principle said, ‘We are standing here. This is our ground’.
J.L. I was thinking how precious it must be in the sight of heaven to see persons at the present time prepared to take a public stand in faithfulness and loyalty to the Lord Jesus in the midst of a world of such evil. It seems to be a very positive stance taken to bear evidence of where they were in their affections.
A.M. That is right. As you say, how much it must mean to the Lord Himself now. How much it must mean for the Father. This was His Son, and He was being rejected, and there were these women, and it was as if they said, ‘We are taking our stand here alongside the rejected One’.
J.D.G. In the other gospels they “stood afar off”, Luke 23:49. Do you think they were drawn closer, attracted to that blessed Man, as time went on and they stood by that cross?
A.M. I think that is helpful. It was affection that caused them to stand there.
J.D.G. Experiences in life should draw us closer to Jesus.
A.M. They should, and with two of these women, you can see that they had great experience. We do not know about them all, but we know of two. Think of Mary of Magdala. She would say, ‘I owe everything to this One’. Her affections were bound up with Him, and she was drawn to Him. He says, “I, if I be lifted up out of the earth, will draw all to me”, John 12:32. Ultimately, everything for God is secured as being drawn to Christ.
W.M.P. The writer adds, “whom he loved”. John must have been conscious that, even though the Lord Jesus was on the cross, His love was towards them. Your point is that today He loves persons like this.
A.M. We understand that John’s gospel was the last book of the Bible that was written. Think of all the years that had passed, and John had seen so much; he had seen the apostles come and go. John was the last of the apostles; all the others had been martyred. The years had gone by, the breakdown had come in and the church publicly was in ruins; souls had departed. Yet John looked back, and he has this abiding impression of the love of Jesus. He says, “and the disciple standing by, whom he loved”. He might have said, ‘I am not putting my name there. What I want to impress you with is that there is one whom Jesus loved’. John went right through, and that love still goes through.
N.J.H. The “blood and water” comes into this chapter (v.34) and was witnessed by John. That would have preserved the public church from decline. I was thinking of what you said about our continuance. There is every ingredient here for our links together to be right and for us to go on to the end in living attachment to Christ.
A.M. We referred yesterday to John’s epistle and how he brings in: “This is he that came by water and blood, Jesus the Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood”, 1 John 5:6. Then he speaks of the Spirit as well. What resource there is! I am sure most, if not all, in this room have known something of the value of the blood. May everyone here be assured as to that. But then the water is still available for cleansing; the Holy Spirit is here. What resources we have to be maintained, standing by the cross of Jesus!
D.C.B. Mary of Magdala would be someone who had received mercy. Is that how we begin, by appreciating the mercy of God that is shown at the cross?
A.M. That is what I thought. Such was her history. She might have said, ‘I was completely lost – there was no hope’. She was an extreme case, but she was not too extreme for the Lord and she would never have lost her sense of mercy. How precious it is to be maintained in a sense of mercy. There were those in the old dispensation who had a sense of mercy, and it was passed on from generation to generation. In David’s administration, you find there were positions given to persons who still identified themselves as the sons of Korah. Think of the mercy that their fathers had found, and David provided a place for them in his administration; they would have served with willing hearts because of the sense of mercy that they had. May we never lose that sense of mercy.
R.T. Later in the book Mary says, “They have taken away the Lord”, John 20:2. Is that where affection leads us, that He becomes Lord to us?
A.M. Yes, indeed, and that is an important step.
R.T. It is noticeable that the apostles all speak about Him as the Lord. At the end of the gospel, John says, “It is the Lord” (chap.21:7). Jesus becomes authoritative, not in the sense of legality, but through affection. The life of Mary was bound up with Him; she had nothing if He was not there.
A.M. I think that is very helpful. In our histories as believers, we first come to know Him as our Saviour, but then there is another step. If that One is my Savour, if I owe everything to Him, then He has a claim upon me and He is my Lord. The fact that He is my Saviour is settled once and for all, but the fact that He is my Lord is something I have to be maintained in day by day.
R.T. When they went away fishing, they lost that connection, but when they saw the fire of coals there, John said, “It is the Lord”. He is discerned through the affectionate link we have with Him.
A.M. That is right. John had gone along with his brethren. How easy it is to do that, and that night they caught nothing; there was no fruit at all. Suddenly John says, “It is the Lord”, and the whole position changed.
J.D. Do you think then that as my Lord, He really commands my affections?
A.M. That is right. It is not a harsh relationship at all. We can see the meaning of the word when Sarah called Abraham lord (1 Pet.3:6). There is no harshness in that, it is a relationship of affection, but it is recognising that He has a claim upon me.
J.B.I. Say more what is in your mind as to the Lord ordering the circumstances of these dear ones.
A.M. Is it not in keeping with John’s gospel, where everything is in His hands? He does everything. He “went out, bearing his cross” (John 19:17), and now here He sees these faithful ones there, standing by the cross. The Lord recognised what was due in nature. We need to be clear that natural relationships are of God. They must be held in their place, for they are of God. He has established them, but they are subservient to what is due to the Lord. The Lord takes account of His mother, then He takes account of John, and He could see in John one to whom He could entrust His mother. We read elsewhere in the gospels that He Himself had taken care of His mother. He had taken her and moved to Capernaum, for instance (John 2:12); He accepted responsibility for the household. Here He sees in John one who appreciated Him perhaps above all, and so was one to whom He could entrust the care of His mother.
J.B.I. It seems very practical. We have been speaking of owning Him as our Lord. He has to say as to what is suitable to Him in our circumstances, and it is at the cross.
A.M. Yes it is, and the cross is a test for everything. Our circumstances, our lives, our careers, whatever it is, we have to view them in the light of the cross of Jesus. How do things seem when I see the cross of Jesus in this way? He is the Lord, but we see Him here on the cross. The whole world is set against Him, but there are those who are identified with Him and they are the ones who are in power.
R.G. Do you think that the Lord seals this matter of love and authority going together? He said, “If ye love me, keep my commandments” (John 14:15), but He immediately seals that by saying, “And I will beg the Father, and he will give you another Comforter”. Is that how this would be worked out?
A.M. Yes. We need the Comforter in order to keep the Lord’s commandments, so the one who loved Him so much, who heard those words and recorded them, writes in another place “his commandments are not grievous”, 1 John 5:3. They are commandments of love. What is the commandment? How do we know? In normal relationships a man will know what his wife would think, or a woman would know what would please her husband, without him expressing it. It is not exactly a commandment of lordship in the sense of imposed authority, but she would regard it as a commandment of love, the claims of love.
R.G. Another has spoken of it as love’s opportunity.
A.M. Yes, that is good.
P.A.G. You mentioned that what goes through was in your mind. I wondered if you could say something about that for our help.
A.M. Do you have something particularly in your mind in asking this?
P.A.G. The Lord says here, “It is finished”. There is a certain line of things that is finished, so what goes through is the product of what the Lord finished.
A.M. Yes. I was very affected years ago in reading something about the Ethiopian eunuch. He was reading Isaiah 53 where it says, “who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth”, Acts 8:33. He was reading that version of the Bible, the Septuagint, which reads like that: “his life is taken from the earth”. The original says, “for he was cut off out of the land of the living”, Isa.53:8. He read, “for his life is taken from the earth”. Mr Raven pointed out that, in the previous chapter, Stephen had looked up into heaven and seen the Son of man standing, while in the chapter following, the Lord Jesus had appeared to Saul on the road to Damascus and said, “why dost thou persecute me?”, Acts 9:41. There is a heavenly order of life continuing. Christ is in glory, but there is something continuing here, a life continuing which is the fruit of His death, the fruit of His work.
P.A.G. That is very helpful. I thought about that when you spoke of the cross as the point of separation. We cannot connect anything that was ended at the cross with what goes through. There must be separation between what was ended at the cross and what goes through. One has no part with the other.
A.M. And the basis on which we enter into that is our love for the One who was there. We had a preaching locally once when a brother referred to verses earlier in this chapter: “And he went out, bearing his cross, to the place called place of a skull, which is called in Hebrew, Golgotha; where they crucified him, and with him two others, one on this side, and one on that, and Jesus in the middle”, John 19:17,18. Now, we know that one of the malefactors was saved. John, in writing this, was “on this side”, the saved malefactor was “on this side”, and the women also were “on this side”; but the world was as it were “on that” side.
N.C.McK. Is it the lordship of Christ that determines our position here? I was wondering if the place that Christ has in the world here determines our position. I wondered if that linked with the thought of Him being Lord. He is our Lord; we belong to Him; and we take the same position as He has taken.
A.M. Exactly, we take that position in responsibility. Now, actually as to a believer, what is true of a believer is in keeping with the Lord’s own position. That must be so because the believer is united to Christ: “But he that is joined to the Lord is one Spirit”, 1 Cor.6:17. Every believer who has the Spirit is united to Christ. That was something that struck Mr Darby in the early days: if I have the gift of the Holy Spirit, I am united to Christ; if that is true of me, it is true of every believer; and if that is true of every believer, then that means that there is a Head in heaven and His body is here, united to Him, but in the scene of responsibility. I have to be true to that and I have to own Him as Lord and accept His claim upon me.
P.J.W. Is that demonstrated with Jonathan and Mephibosheth? I do not think Jonathan ever owned David as lord. He went back into the city, but Mephibosheth said, “My lord, O king”, 2 Sam.19:26. He was prepared to be in reproach when David was rejected.
A.M. Yes; Jonathan said, “I shall be next to thee”, 1 Sam.23:17. He was a true believer. He wanted to see David exalted, but he said, ‘I will be second’. Mephibosheth called himself “a dead dog”, 2 Sam.9:8, taking the ground that he had nothing to commend him, even to the extent of giving up what we might say were his rights. He said in principle, ‘It does not matter. Christ is the Man for me. The exultation of that One is all that matters’.
R.T. It was the cave of Adullam that brought out the allegiance of persons. It very quickly says that David “became a captain over them”, 1 Sam.22:2. There were six hundred to begin with and they soon multiplied greatly. But Jonathan died on the mountain.
A.M. I have often thought of the fact that when Jonathan and David parted, “Jonathan went into the city”, 1 Sam.20:42. Maybe he thought that he could help to improve things in the city, and there are many who have thought that they could improve the world. But if you go into the world to improve it, you become part of it. You do not improve the world; it is incurable.
J.L Mr Darby said that whatever Christ's present relation to the world is, that is the Christian's too – the place which the Lord is in above, and the place that He is not in below, defines our place2. He was not in the city where Jonathan went back to; He is not in the world. The two things seem to doubly emphasise the necessity for us steering our course wisely where Christ is not and where He is. We have to define that.
A.M They came to the point where they had to define their position. David, to a degree, was given a place in Saul’s realm, but it came to a point when David’s place was empty. He was not there. Jonathan, a true believer, wanted to be with David; they met at that rock Ezel, and that was the point of decision (1 Sam.20:19-23). They came to the point of decision, and every one of us in our histories, beloved, has to come to a point of decision. There are many of us here who can say that it is more blessed to throw in your lot with the rejected One than to seek to go along without Him.
Q.A.P. I wondered if there is a link with what Paul says, “For as often as ye shall eat this bread, and drink the cup, ye announce the death of the Lord, until he come”, 1 Cor.11:26. It is remarkable that we call to mind One who is living, but publicly, in the testimony, we are associated with His death.
A.M. I think that is right. The Supper is a public matter. I have sometimes thought: if a believer is genuinely seeking their way, we could say ‘come to the Supper’. We “announce the death of the Lord”. We take our stand by the cross of Jesus, and see where it leads; it leads into the very presence of God.
J.T.B. John was “standing by”. Does that suggest availability to take on any service the Lord might suggest? I was thinking of the reference in Zechariah, “And the Angel of Jehovah protested unto Joshua, saying, Thus saith Jehovah of hosts: If thou wilt walk in my ways, and if thou wilt keep my charge … I will give thee a place to walk among these that stand by”, Zech.3:6,7. Is there a particular attraction about standing by in an available way?
A.M. That is right. It is as if John was waiting. He might have said in this context, ‘What can I do? I have been used to the Lord guiding us, leading us here. Now He is on the cross, what can I do? I will go to the cross, take my place there, and wait for His direction’.
D.M.C. You were speaking about inviting persons to come along to the Supper. Do you think persons might take account of us during the week in our walk and they might come to the Supper and say, ‘Is their walk consistent with what they profess?’. What they see at the Supper should be in consistency with our life here.
A.M. I think it should be, and I think that is something we should test ourselves with: “But let a man prove himself”, 1 Cor.11:28. So is my life consistent? If I bring someone to the Supper, they might say, ‘I did not have any idea that you experienced anything like this’. Why did they not have any idea? What has my testimony been? I think what you say is helpful. The Supper is the most wonderful occasion; there is nothing like it. It is a special time for the saints and, I would say, for the Lord. There was a sister who decided she was not interested anymore, and she was asked, ‘Do you not miss the Lord’s supper?’. She said, ‘I never really got anything out of it. I do not really miss it’, and a sister said, ‘But the Lord misses you’. That was the one point in the conversation that appeared to affect her: ‘the Lord misses you’. The Supper is a great occasion where we can publicly state our allegiance to Christ.
D.M.C. It has been said that we are either coming from the Supper or going to the Supper.
A.M. That is right. What we receive at the Supper should characterise us for the rest of the week. It is before us tomorrow morning if the Lord leaves us here, and that occasion will be greater than what we enjoyed yesterday or what we are enjoying today. It is a greater experience to actually have part in the service of God in the full worship of God in His presence.
N.J.H. Does what the Lord says to John at the end of the book, “If I will that he abide until I come” (John 21:22) link with him being the only apostle who was at the cross?
A.M. That is good; you mean the witness?
N.J.H. I thought it would have a bearing particularly on John’s epistles. They make very clear what was outside of the holiness of God, and what was in keeping with the holiness of God. I wondered if “If I will that he abide until I come” suggests a certain character that is meant to remain.
A.M. That is right. John gives us a peculiar character to Christianity, the family idea. We have been brought into this wonderful divine family and that goes through; John was a witness. There were three disciples who were special witnesses in the life of the Lord Jesus. They witnessed His power over death in the house of Jairus. They witnessed His glory on the mountain, the glory of the Son of God, and they witnessed His sufferings in Gethsemane. Those three men were Peter, James and John, and Satan marked them out. He wanted to have that witness destroyed so James was martyred very quickly and then Peter was taken. These were the witnesses to the greatness of Christ, and Satan would seek to remove them. Peter, while he was preserved for longer for the sake of the church, was taken, but John went on, a great testimony there, and John says, ‘There is another witness in the Holy Spirit’.
R.D.P. John often refers to himself as the disciple whom Jesus loved, but here it says, “and the disciple standing by, whom he loved”. I wondered if that was something additional, that He not only loved John personally but He loved him as standing by. You referred to the fact that John’s gospel was the last of the writings. John had been given much, which he wrote of in the Revelation. He had seen something of the Lord in another form (Rev.2:12-16). I wondered if John “standing by, whom he loved” was something that meant so much to the Lord’s heart.
A.M. That is right, and John would have had a sense of that. I suppose, in his communion with the Lord afterwards, he would have the sense that the Lord really valued the fact that he was taking that place and that he had been there. John enjoyed His affections in flesh and blood conditions in His life down here, but the fact that he was standing by the Lord in His rejection was something that was very precious to the Lord, and He imparted a sense of that to John.
J.L. He speaks of himself at that point as “the disciple”. A disciple is a follower. Had he and those there followed as far as they could? Christ had now to go forward alone as the only One who could enter into the totality of what the cross involved.
A.M. Yes, that is right, and John brings that out; “Where I go thou canst not follow me now”. Jesus had to go that way alone, but He was looking for those who would follow afterwards: “but thou shalt follow me after” John 13: 36. John was a follower.
P.M. It does not say, ‘And by the cross stood a little group of people’. These are individuals. I was thinking of what has been said, that the Lord has something individually to impress each one with in view of the continuance of the testimony.
A.M. Yes, each one is identified. In the beginning of Acts we have “the crowd of names”, Acts 1:15. Each one is identified. They are not listed for us, but they are listed in heaven. You might say, they are all written on His heart.
P.M. I was thinking that when Jehovah comes to inscribe the peoples (Ps.87:6), He is writing something on their hearts for the continuation of the testimony here. Is something inscribed upon us at the Supper in view of continuance for the coming week?
A.M. Yes, “this man was born there”, Ps.87:4. There is something written which goes through.
W.M.P. So who are the “us” in “therefore let us”? Who are the kind of persons that are going to be attracted to respond to this exhortation? I am linking with what our brother has just said about how we are secured.
A.M. Well, it is an exhortation to us all. I think they are the kind of persons whose hearts have been won and taken up with this blessed Man. I think these women in John set that out. It is not a legal matter, it is a heart matter, a matter of our affections. Can I be content to go along without the One who has suffered for me? Could I go without Him? The writer says, “let us go forth to him”. It is not to go forth to a position, it is to “go forth to him”. We find our place as we go to Him, “go forth to him without the camp, bearing his reproach”. I feel I can say very little about bearing His reproach, something that I know very little of.
D.C.B. Moses esteemed “the reproach of the Christ greater riches than the treasures of Egypt”, Heb.11:26. That was his reproach.
A.M. Yes, he went out. In the end, Moses became like the One we go out to, did he not? Initially, Moses acted like Egypt. He smote the Egyptian and buried him in the sand and hoped nothing would be seen of it, but eventually he became like the One we go out to, the meekest man in all the earth (Num.12:3). In Exodus and Numbers, when Moses was attacked, or the people murmured, his reaction was to fall upon his face. There we see the meekest man in all the earth; he fell upon his face to the ground. In a sense he would say, ‘I am nothing’. He had gone forth to the One who had suffered reproach.
D.C.B. He chose “rather to suffer affliction along with the people of God”, Heb.11:25. He had the company of others.
A.M. That was a deliberate choice. Let us all make that deliberate choice, beloved brethren. Some of us might appear to have our lives before us. You might have to make a choice as to your work or whatever you are going to do. Make it deliberate! Make it deliberate in relation to the Lord Jesus on the cross. One thing you will find is that people will begin to know you. You will find as you go to work, that after a little while people will not ask you to go to lunch with them and things like that. They will not ask you to join in with their activities because they will know what the answer will be. Just make it deliberate. Make that choice and be committed to it; “let us go forth to him without the camp”.
G.B.G. Moses “had respect to the recompense”, Heb.11:26. There is recompense in it.
A.M. That is right. It is far greater than what we might give up.
G.B.G. Moses had very intimate relationships with God, uniquely so. That is part of the recompense.
A.M. Yes, it is. You could not put a price on what we gain from our link with God, our link with the Lord. People try to plan things. They have a great plan and then they always need a Plan B and they will find that Plan B fails as well. The believer does not. He goes forward in faith and somebody will say, ‘What about this? What are you going to do if this happens?’ Well, the Lord will provide. Some of us were saying last night privately that doors close, and the Lord opens another door. It is the Lord that does it. It does not just happen. Your heart goes out to the Lord and you thank Him that He has provided for you, and you get a deeper impression of what He is.
G.B.G. “But seek ye first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things shall be added unto you”, Matt.6:33. We cannot see down the years if we are left here, but the Lord can. Even in relation to our material circumstances or matters, accept your restriction, and the Lord provides.
A.M. That is right. How many have proved that.
R.G. Can you say something about this expression, “We have an altar”?
A.M. You say something because you have been thinking about it.
R.G. Well, it is “We have”. I was thinking of Paul’s reference in Corinthians, “I received from the Lord, that which I also delivered to you”, 1 Cor.11:23. That is something which has been placed, so to speak, in our hands. You say it is a privilege. Yes, it is, but there is the side of sacrifice that must run along with that.
A.M. We must be prepared for the sacrifice and then we will find that there are many thoughts connected with the altar. Acceptance, approach; all these things are connected with the altar. It involves sacrifice, but really, what can we say as to sacrifice?
R.G. We find that there is a wealth connected with this. Just as you have been saying, we go on and our faith is tried, but we have this as a central object, “We have an altar”. Whose altar is it? It is the Lord’s.
A.M. Yes, and in that sense we can lay claim to it.
J.W. I was thinking of what was said of Moses. He “had respect to the recompense”, but actually he esteemed “the reproach of the Christ greater riches than the treasures of Egypt” (Heb.11.26); not the recompense but the reproach itself.
A.M. That is good. Moses during his early years had been brought up in Pharaoh’s palace, or had lived in connection with that palace. I believe he was a man of great military exploits – he had a great name and you can understand that at the end of it all, he might have said, ‘But it is all empty. The whole thing is empty’. And he went out to see his brethren, those whom God had given him. He had seen what man had done and it was hollow, but what God had given him was brethren. He went out and in principle he took on “the reproach of the Christ”. To be identified with a position of reproach is the greatest treasure.
J.W. So Peter says, “If ye are reproached in the name of Christ, blessed are ye”, 1 Pet.4:14.
A.M. Yes, that is fine.
R.D.P. This was the last the world saw of the Lord. The disciples did, of course, and the five hundred brethren to whom he appeared during the forty days, but the world never saw Him again. I wondered if that had a special bearing on “bearing his reproach”. There was no room for Him, for His thoughts, for His works and no room for His life. As far as the world is concerned, He suffered this ignominious death, and it never saw Him again. Is that not the particular bearing of “his reproach”? It is not so much about entering into religious arguments and points, but that this scene of things down here has no place whatever for Christ.
A.M. I have been quite affected lately that Peter says that He was “cast away indeed as worthless”, 1 Pet.2:4. What a word to use about our Lord! He was “cast away indeed as worthless”; that was their estimation, but this is the One into whose hands everything has been committed, and we can “go forth to him … bearing his reproach”. The world has no place for that Man.
R.D.P It is a very definite thing. I have always been very struck by that. It says, “without the gate”. It is as if you open the gate and you go through.
A.M. Yes, you just do not slide into it.
R.DP. He “suffered without the gate”; there is a deliberate movement in relation to it.
R.T. Did Mr Raven not say that “without the camp” becomes “inside the veil3”? What about the “coming city” here?
A.M. You help us.
R.T. We have to have an objective. Is it upward or is it downward? We seek the “coming city”.
A.M. And it is a glorious one. What a glorious objective it is. We see the reproach here and we may take too much account of the reproach; we may say, ‘Am I really able for this?’. Well, look at the city. Look at what we have been led to, the glory of that city. Abraham looked for it. He will see it but he did not have part in it as we will.
R.T. “Of which God is the artificer” (Heb.11:10), “the coming one”. It cannot be interfered with, and our access towards it cannot be interfered with either. We are seeking it.
A.M. That is very good. There is something there which no man can touch, no human can touch, no fleshly activity can touch. It is secured above. John saw that city. It was given to him to see it, given to the one who was there by the cross.
R.T. The more Abraham sought it, the more light he got; “the steps of the faith … of our father Abraham”, Rom.4:12. You can see them. In each step there was some fresh revelation from God that led him on.
A.M. I think that is very important, and it is a word to us. We all know what it is to say ‘I just do not understand very much. Brethren speak about things, and I do not understand’. Lay hold of what you do understand! Be true to it, and the Lord will give you more. You do not go through Christian experience in great bounds. You go one step at a time, you learn the Lord in every step of the way and you find that He is leading up to a glorious end.
D.J.H. So we “announce the death of the Lord, until he come”, 1 Cor.11:26. There is a glorious end in view. It was once said that if the world realised what was involved in the Supper, they would not let us do it.
A.M. And the Supper involves both the cross and the coming glory. We have the loaf and the cup. The last that was seen of the Lord Jesus was a body slain and blood shed. The Lord says, ‘I am giving you the tokens of this in the Supper’. That was the starting point and it is in view of “until he come”.
D.J.H. The next time they see Him it will be in glory.
A.M. It will be in glory, and we will be with Him; a wonderful thing. We will not be standing by the cross then because we will be in conditions like Himself, His own body of glory. What a prospect we have!
D.J.H. So what a value the Supper is to us in that light. It takes us right out of this world altogether in view of that world where He is the Centre.
A.M. Yes, that is good. We should look briefly at Corinthians. Paul speaks about the princes of this age, if they had known what they were doing, would not have done it (1 Cor.2:8). I think your remark would connect with that. The apostle is saying that he announced nothing “save Jesus Christ, and him crucified”. He was announcing this to the Corinthians, and this epistle is particularly concerned with the assembly down here. Paul is saying, ‘If you want to experience assembly life at all, you start here: the cross is your entrance into assembly life’. The cross is our entrance into all that we experience, everything that we know as assembled together. It leads onto the highest things, but the cross is the entrance.
W.W.L. I think the remark was made yesterday that Paul wrote this epistle standing by the cross of Christ. Does that come out in chapter 2 when he says, “I was with you in weakness and in fear and in much trembling”. He was not afraid of the Corinthians, but he was fearful in case anything of the flesh came out in his ministry.
A.M. That is right. Paul was not a man who was given naturally to “much trembling”. He was a man who could demand what he wanted. He was that kind of man, “an insolent overbearing man” (1 Tim.1:13), as he says himself. Yet, lest anything should come in that had been put away at the cross of Christ, he said, “I was with you in weakness and in fear and in much trembling”. Think of how he was maintained before the Lord in all his service in order that nothing should intrude that would spoil it. The cross is presented here as foolishness and as weakness to men. It is despised; it is seen as a reproach here. But, as taking up this position, we enter into what belongs to the assembly down here.
N.J.H. Paul says, “I am crucified with Christ” (Gal.2:20), but here it is “Jesus Christ, and him crucified”. Can you help us about that?
A.M. In Galatians, the apostle is really setting out his position with Christ. The Galatians had given up all sense of grace, given up the character of the day in which we are. They were going to a legal system. Really the apostle is saying, ‘You are undermining the foundations of Christianity. This is the ground I take: “I am crucified with Christ”’. Later he goes on, “But far be it from me to boast save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ”. Think of Paul bringing in that full assembly title with all the affection that he had for that blessed One, “through whom the world is crucified to me, and I to the world”, Gal.6:14. That was the place that he was taking. I remember a brother saying that he thought that Paul, in his mind’s eye, looked at that scene at Golgotha and he saw himself on the cross of one malefactor, the world on the cross of the other and the cross of Jesus between; “through whom the world is crucified to me, and I to the world”. It means it is finished. There was no future at all for Paul in the world and there was no future for the world in Paul. He takes that ground and he takes the Galatians back to that ground. They were giving up the very basis of Christianity, and he says in effect, ‘Get back to the cross, and then you can enter into normal Christian experience’.
R.D.P. So serious was the error at Galatia that they had moved off Christian ground. They had moved away from the cross and, by so doing, they had taken a step off Christian ground. It is one of the few books in the New Testament where there is no mention of the Lord’s coming. They had moved off Christian ground.
A.M. Galatian error was more serious than Corinthian error. In Corinth, Paul could take account of “the assembly of God which is in Corinth”, 1 Cor.1:2. In Galatians, the epistle ends abruptly. There are not the extended salutations you get in other epistles. The Galatians had moved away from Christian ground, and the answer is the cross.
N.C.McK. Does the camp in Hebrews have a certain religious aspect? Paul was anxious that the flesh would in no way intrude into assembly ground in that way, nor association with the camp.
A.M. That is right. The religious world is most insidious. It can have the appearance of being right in many ways. It might be in a great deal of activity, or it may be in “harsh treatment of the body” and things like that which Paul speaks of to the Colossians (chap.2:23). The religious world is a very insidious thing, but here he says, ‘Start in this way, “Jesus Christ, and him crucified”’.
W.M.P. Is this matter absolutely crucial to the health of a local assembly? If it is not there, then what would be our outlook? It would be the flesh, as has been remarked; it would be what is of man that would predominate, rather than what is of Christ.
A.M. Yes, it must be. Something has to be in evidence, and if it is not of our Lord Jesus Christ, then it will be something else that has been terminated at the cross. Dear brethren, these things are easy to say, but what would be the value of meetings like this if we do not take it to ourselves, that all that I am naturally as man has to go? It has gone in the death of the Lord Jesus. For the full enjoyment of what God is looking for here, I begin at the cross and enter into what is most blessed.
T.C.M. Can you say something about these things from verse 27 that God has chosen? It would seem that His choice is a very critical matter.
A.M. That is right. He cannot choose the wisdom of the world. He cannot choose the strength of the world. They had had these things in Corinth; they had had the benefit of Greek wisdom, they had had the benefit of Roman might. It was all being displayed there; they were living in such a day. But Paul says, ‘God has not chosen this’. What do men despise? What do men think of as nothing? “To Jews an offence, and to nations foolishness”. The Greeks think the cross is foolishness and the Jews find it offensive because of the curse. Paul says, ‘God has chosen this way’. It is the way of infinite wisdom that God has chosen in order to bring about what is pleasing to Him here on the earth at the present time.
R.T. Paul seemed to bring in the “demonstration of the Spirit and of power”. Is that something we should look for in our localities, pursuing the line that we are on today? It is what the Galatians needed. They had grieved the Spirit, if not quenched Him, but the grieving of the Spirit would shut out the “demonstration of the Spirit”. Is that what we should look for in guidance in our exercises, a “demonstration of the Spirit”?
A.M. That is right. It is very easy just to approach things from a human point of view and see the way man’s mind works when we are in difficulties, but the “demonstration of the Spirit and of power” is blessed.
R.T. It brought the Corinthians round.
D.M.C. Would “demonstration of the Spirit” glorify Christ in anything that we do or say?
A.M. Yes, it would. That is His normal service, to glorify Him. There is power in His service.
R.T. I think we should be exercised about looking for that power. We try to meet things on a lower level, try to meet questions by arguing and that kind of thing, but where is the room made for the “demonstration of the Spirit”? He “speaks expressly” (1 Tim.4:1), and He is still speaking.
A.M. He still is, and it can be experienced today. The breakdown has not altered that. We are in times of weakness and failure. We are very conscious of the fact that we are not living in the glorious days of the apostles. We are not living in the days of those who have led in the opening out of the truth. We are not living in days when there was a brother you could turn to with any question, and he would give the answer. But the Holy Spirit is here, He abides with us and He remains; there is every divine resource. I remember a brother saying ‘Greater than Mr Darby is here; greater than Mr Raven is here; greater than Mr Taylor is here’. He was not speaking about himself; he was speaking about the presence of the Holy Spirit.
R.T. “And the Spirit and the bride say, Come” (Rev.22:17); it is one voice!
A.M. That is right, and that will be the great evidence that all that has been committed to that blessed divine Person has been brought through in holy perfection.
R.G. Do you think then that a fresh appreciation of the cross, as involving clearance, makes way for the operation of the Spirit in our localities?
A.M. That is good. Can you help us further?
R.G. It has often been remarked that Paul uses the cross and the Spirit in chapters 1 and 2 of 1 Corinthians, and in Galatians he reverts to the cross and the Spirit, on the line of recovery. Would that be a healthy exercise for us?
A.M. Yes, so may we be maintained in this. You were remarking yesterday on Mr Darby’s comment on the need to be kept by the cross and to be kept in our links with the Holy Spirit, that is, in communion with the Holy Spirit. How much do we know of actually communing with the Holy Spirit? We speak to Him, we address Him, but what do we know of communion with Him?
P.A.G. Is it significant that reconciliation and peace are linked with the cross in both Colossians and Ephesians?
A.M. Yes, I was thinking about that. It is significant.
Glasgow
15 August 2015