READINGS ON THE CORINTHIAN EPISTLES (6)
READINGS ON THE CORINTHIAN EPISTLES (6)
FER I think the ministry as it comes out in this epistle is remarkable. It is not the ministry of the gospel, not of the mystery, but it is really between the two in a sense. In chapter 3 it is the ministry of the new covenant, in chapter 5 the ministry of reconciliation,
ED Does the ministry of the Spirit cover those terms?
FER That is connected with the new covenant. Two things are spoken of there, the Spirit and righteousness. They are the terms of the new covenant. The new covenant is not exactly the same thing as the gospel. The ministry of it is to people in relationship to God, and also the ministry of reconciliation.
Ques Would that be more individual?
FER I think the new covenant and reconciliation [p. 408] are individual. You do not come to the corporate thought until you come to the mystery.
DLH What about the gospel of the glory of Christ, referred to in this chapter?
FER He brings it in to show the activity of the god of this world “who has blinded”, etc. In the beginning of the chapter he says “therefore having this ministry” (2 Corinthians 4:1), that refers to what goes before, but the glory of the Lord is connected with the position of Christ.
WJ Is attention called to the ministry?
FER In the latter part of the chapter you see the discipline through which the vessel passed. The first part of the chapter is a widening of the ground. He had spoken of the ministry of the new covenant, with the object of showing he was not on Jewish ground.
Ques The glory of Christ here, is it as Administrator?
FER The point is to put the Lord on a platform wider than Israel, it is the glory of Christ, the image of God and the glory of God in His face, not in the midst of Israel but in His face.
DLH You do not look upon the ministry of the new covenant exactly as our gospel.
FER It is glad tidings, that is the gospel. I do not think the ministry of the new covenant and the glad tidings are synonymous.
DLH So when he says, “If also our gospel is veiled” (2 Corinthians 4:3), he is enlarging the ground?
FER I think so, he says, “By manifestation — to every conscience of men” (2 Corinthians 4:2), not simply to the Jew.
SD Is that light or testimony?
FER It is testimony. The contrast is truth, and its testimony, and the truth is what may be known of God.
DLH Is not the minister, the vessel, to be the exponent of that?
FER That comes out in the end [p. 409] of the chapter.
The first part of the chapter refers to the other testimony. “We preach not ourselves” (2 Corinthians 4:5), etc.
JSO There is no room here for dishonesty, craftiness, etc., it is truth here that is manifested.
FER I think so. The Jew was given to handling God’s word deceitfully, he did not make the word of God bear its own meaning. They altered God’s word by tradition and allegorising it in a way.
Ques Do you say in chapter 2 it is the ministry to the saints, and there is a widening out in chapter 4?
FER I think so, if you speak of covenant it indicates the terms which God is in relationship with the people.
FLH I think that is very simple. If God makes a covenant He makes it with somebody.
FER You must be in some kind of covenant down here. The covenant is established in the blood of Christ, and the terms — righteousness and the Spirit, both hold good to us.
DLH It is rather striking that the truth of the new covenant is found as written in 1 Corinthians 2:11.
FER All was established in Christ’s death. The terms of the new covenant are to us what they are to Israel. All that offended God has been removed in Christ’s death and therefore it is “the new covenant in my blood”, 1 Corinthians 11:25. The blood was the witness that death had come in, man had gone, Christ the One who died is the One to administrate the new covenant. He carries it all into effect. He is the Mediator of the new covenant, Hebrews 12:24.
ED Is there a difference between the “glory of Christ” and of the Lord?
FER Lord is referring to administration more.
DLH Therefore you get the Lord in chapter 3.
FER Yes. There was the glory connected with the minister here. So far as I understand it, the glory is connected with the epistle. The glory in the face of a man was a glory beyond the measure of a [p. 410] man, He brought it from God. Like Moses — Moses was to be outside of man. You get the same thing in a stronger way in the new covenant. What explains it to men is this “truly our fellowship” (1 John 1:3), etc. It is a distinction beyond what is proper to man.
DLH Do you refer to the expression “the glory of Christ”, etc.?
FER I refer to chapter 3, a veil on the face. It is a glory connected with their ministry. If the administration of death was introduced by glory, much more the ministry of righteousness which subsists in glory, 2 Corinthians 3:11.
WJ It is within the measure of a Man in chapter 4, the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ, 2 Corinthians 4:6.
FER I do not think so. I mean the measure of a man down here, in the apostle. He was brought into divine association with the work, the service was beyond the measure of a man.
Ques Do you mean beyond the measure of a man actually?
FER Yes.
Rem Christ is a Man after another order now?
FER He was ever that.
WB You mean the moment He came into manhood?
FER Yes. There was no measure in Christ as to the glory beyond the measure of a man. He was “My beloved Son”, 2 Peter 1:17. He never received glory but what was His own. He might have glory in a sense as Man, in contrast to His humiliation, but all the glory was His own.
JR Death and resurrection made a difference in Him as to His Person?
FER No. He was a Man. One by Himself.
DLH When He came into manhood, He brought into it what was outside of man and indeed, was limited to Himself, until He rose again.
FER Quite [p. 411] so.
WB Do you think anyone but an apostle could say what is in verse 3. “If our gospel be hid” (2 Corinthians 4:3), etc.?
FER I do not think so. It is apostolic. He is trying to draw christians into fellowship with him. We ought to allow the apostles their own place. It is a question of spiritual privilege. They had nothing but what we have, but in service they had what we have not, they are the foundation. We do not gain anything by obscuring them, and you will not lose by giving them the glory which God gave them.
JSO Paul’s position more especially.
FER The ministry of law set before man what was due from him, but when you come to the ministry of the new covenant it is a setting forth of God and the glory connected with it is a glory beyond the measure of a man. One of the most wonderful words ever spoken is in John 20:21, “As the Father sent me forth, I also send you”, etc.
Ques Is that which is outside the measure of man confined to what is apostolic?
FER You may come into it in a way. The apostles had undertaken, they laid the foundation, and when the terms of the new covenant are declared (they are never declared again) we take them up second-hand in a way.
DLH In our feeble way we take the gospel of the glory and speak of it as set forth in Christ whatever the bearing of it may be in regard to the hearers.
JSO It is apostolic ministry rendered, though not by apostles?
FER Quite so.
WB The gospel that they preached is the gospel that has to be preached today.
FER Yes, I think we ought to take it to heart whether there ought not to be more of the ministry of which this epistle speaks, a ministry to saints, whether they are not in great need of ministry such as the apostle here speaks of. If you were to go to the [p. 412] mass of people in communion and ask them if they could tell you on what terms God is with them, I doubt if they could answer you. Israel in the millennium will understand the terms on which God is with them, and it is equally important for us to know our terms.
DJ It is not really changing the attitude towards God?
FER That comes out in the ministry of reconciliation, the new covenant is God’s attitude towards us, reconciliation is ours towards God. You just want to see the terms God is on with you.
DLH What is the gospel of the glory of Christ in chapter 4?
FER In chapter 4 the apostle has in His mind the Jew, the unbelieving Jew, he says “In whom the god of this world” (2 Corinthians 4:4), that has reference to the Jew.
DLH This word ‘lost’ here, is not the same as in Luke 15, it is a final lost?
FER I think so. It is a people who have had every kind of testimony presented to them and they are unbelieving. They were the people from whom naturally the light should have shone.
DLH If the brightest light fails to impress a person it is pretty clear what is the matter with him.
FER I think it is so.
WB If one was to do that today you could not say that that person was eternally lost?
FER But I could not say that there could not be a person of that kind.
WB It is possible that there could be such a case but you could not put your hand upon the individual.
FER Not in the present day, but with the Jew there is nothing more for him.
WB What about the gospel of the glory?
FER Gospel makes it a little too conventional. It is better rendered glad tidings. The gospel is not [p. 413] an exact statement, it is the idea of the glad tidings of the glory of Christ.
DLH The same man who speaks about the glory of Christ speaks also of forgiveness, because that is part of the glory of Christ.
FER I think so. It is implied in the expression, “Who is the image of God” (2 Corinthians 4:4), everything is set forth in Him, the perfect setting forth of God in His attitude towards man.
ED Do you connect it with verse 6?
FER That enlarges the thought, it only exemplifies it in that way, it is the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ, 2 Corinthians 4:6. The glory of God is the effulgence of God in the accomplishment of His will. He has accomplished all His will, everything is set forth in Christ, redemption, resurrection, the church, eternal life, whatever it is, inheritance, sonship too, He is Head, the One in whom all the thoughts of God are centred. You first have to take in the thought that Christ Himself is Head and Centre, the One in whom all these are effected and in the carrying out of these things you have the full display of God.
Ques Has that anything to do with the terms on which God is with us?
FER No. I think you have to begin with that, it is the first lesson we have to be settled on, and then you begin to apprehend the setting forth of God’s purpose in Christ. You could not understand Ephesians otherwise. The new covenant comes in in Romans 5. Ephesians 1 is the setting forth of God’s counsel in Christ. You must apprehend the one before you understand the other.
WB Do you mean settled in Romans 5?
FER Yes. The terms of the new covenant are righteousness and the Spirit. God has nothing against me, He has everything for me.
DLH That must be made good before we can apprehend or enter into the counsels [p. 414] of God.
FER I think so. All is set forth in Christ, the glory of God, and you can only learn God in the face of Jesus Christ, you cannot learn anything but in His face. That means in the presence of Christ. It is not literally.
WB It is in Him.
FER That is the point. Every attribute, everything you can conceive of God’s nature is displayed in Jesus Christ. Nothing can add to the glory of God, nothing can confer glory on God, God’s glory is in the display of His Person. If sin had not entered into the world there would have been no occasion for the same display of God that we have.
ED Is not that the reason of sovereignty being brought in in verse 6?
FER I think so.
DLH When he says, “Hath shined in our hearts” (2 Corinthians 4:6) etc., he is still speaking apostolically?
FER I think so. The revelation was given to the apostle.
DLH You could not say that of every believer.
FER I think not. We take it up from the apostles. They had no inspired scriptures to go to, they could not go to the New Testament to consider what they would preach. They might have spoken from the Old Testament, but as to the revelation of God they had no New Testament, they had to speak according to the thought God gave them.
JSO It is really that God has shined in their hearts to shine out.
FER Exactly.
DLH You can take this into moral bearing.
ED You could not give out what you have not received.
DLH I think so far as the light shines in our hearts it produces a similar effect in us.
FER The thought is to have fellowship with the apostles in the light which is given [p. 415] to them.
DLH They were the administrators of it, the Lord shone in to shine out.
FER That is the force of the expression “If our gospel be hid” (2 Corinthians 4:3), Just imagine the Lord speaking on behalf of the apostles and demanding the future for them as in John 17.
WJ When He says, “I am glorified in them”, what is the force of it?
FER They were the vessel in which He was glorified. He was not glorified elsewhere, it was in them. The latter part of our chapter brings before us all that the servant was subjected to, all the vicissitudes through what he passed, the vessel was subjected to it all, in order to be broken like Gideon’s pitcher.
WJ Is it not more the idea of being scooped out, rather than the idea of the pitcher?
FER It is a man broken to pieces as to himself, subjected to every kind of trial and broken as to what he was as a man, completely broken to pieces.
WJ So that he disappears and the light only is seen, is that it?
FER I think so. All that is of God. Man does not come into it a bit. The testimony of God and all connected with it is divine and contrary to man. Man really has no part in it.
JSO The light shone in darkness when Christ came in?
FER Quite so. Christ looked at things from an entirely different standpoint from what man did. It is a great thing to see that the first man has gone, not simply the old man, but the first man. I mean by that the whole order of man. The full results of God’s ways will be seen in the new heavens and new earth, it will not be seen in the millennium because that is not a perfect state of things. The christian looks for the full result and end of God’s way, the new heavens and new earth, as it says in Isaiah “I create new heavens” (Isaiah 65:17), I do not think the first man went in the [p. 416] cross of Christ, but the introduction of the second superseded the first. The old man has gone in the cross, when the second Man comes upon the scene it is a clear case that the first is gone.
JSO Displaced.
FER There is not room for the two, when another comes in the first is gone, but, at the same time in addition to that you get the condemnation of the old man in the cross of Christ. When it comes to condemnation it is as to what man is morally. The first man takes in relationship, etc.
WB Which abide.
FER They do for a moment, but that man is gone.
DLH Things that are seen are temporal, the first man is there.
FER Yes.
DLH And we are in the light of what is eternal, though with regard to the body we have a link with the earth and relationships connected with the present scene, yet we are in the light of the eternal things.
FER Yes, all these things have gone in the ways of God, though I have to be in them for a moment. The first man and everything pertaining to him is set aside in the introduction of the second Man.
W.B. At His incarnation?
FER I think so, though it did not come out fully then, it was by the fact of His being out of heaven, He came from another quarter altogether.
DLH That is origin.
FER Yes.
Ques The outward man, is that the first man?
FER He connected it with him, it is what is true of a christian, it puts him in touch with temporal things, the inner man is that which puts me in touch with heavenly things.
WJ What is the dying of Jesus (2 Corinthians 4:10)?
FER If you are not in communion with [p. 417] the dying of Jesus, it is not likely that the life of Jesus will come out in you. It is the mind of the christian. What Christ entered into in fact, we have to enter into in mind, and it has to be maintained. It is not simply understanding the thing but it is the attitude of my mind. When Christ was crucified, it was in fact; I am crucified in mind, and I maintain it. So, too, if Christ died, He died in fact. I have not died in fact, but I enter into it in mind. The mind is the great contrast between a christian and a natural man. The natural mind is not the fruit of affection, but in the christian the mind is the fruit of affection. That is what the apostle means by knowledge puffs up but love builds up (1 Corinthians 8:1). The mind of the christian is the outcome of love.
WJ So that death works in us, but life in you, what is that?
FER It was the work in the apostles so that the testimony was not hindered, they responded to the love of God.