READINGS ON THE CORINTHIAN EPISTLES (8)
READINGS ON THE CORINTHIAN EPISTLES (8)
FER We have had the ministry in the first five chapters pretty much. Now we come to the ministers and their appeal.
DLH I think there has been an impression that it is much more general. Who is the appeal addressed to, is it to the Corinthians?
FER Yes. The opening verse of this chapter is addressed primarily to the Corinthians, but we should be prepared to take it home, though it was addressed in the first instance to them.
DLH It is a question of the ministry of reconciliation there?
FER I think it is, there are two forms the ministry took, the new covenant and reconciliation.
JGK Do you connect the grace of God with the ministry?
FER The grace of God is a very general thought; it is expressed in the ministry. The apostle’s great idea was that the grace of God should not be ineffective in people. I suppose if the ministry were apprehended it would produce in a person a very great sense of the grace of God. Then I think the anxiety of the apostle was that the grace of God should affect them. Grace reigns through righteousness unto eternal life (Romans 5:21); it is [p. 427] a throne of grace and you want to get to eternal life. That is the apostle’s thought in regard to the Corinthians. The effect of grace is it reigns unto eternal life.
JSO The parenthesis comes in here, a time of grace.
FER Yes, it is a time of grace, the day of salvation; the stress is laid on the ‘now’. The way the apostle desired it to come out is presented in the last part of the chapter. “The grace of God which carries with it salvation for all men has appeared, teaching us” (Titus 2:11), etc.
WJ He narrows the pathway in order to enlarge them.
FER Yes, in worldly associations people only get narrowed. It is only acquaintance with the grace of God that gives enlargement; you are never really enlarged except as you are near God. God is large and if you are near to Him you are enlarged.
WJ The measure of your salvation is the measure of your blessing.
FER I think so. The measure of your salvation is the measure of your apprehension of grace. Grace leads you to consider what is suitable to God, not what is suitable to yourself. That is the proper effect of grace upon a person.
Ques What is the difference between grace and love?
FER Grace is in regard to us, it expresses the way in which God meets us. Love pleases itself. Grace leads you into the knowledge of love. You begin with grace. God began with love. The principle of love is it satisfies itself. That is not the character of grace; grace is God’s attitude. “The grace of God which carries with it salvation” (Titus 2:11), you could not say the love of God that bringeth salvation quite. It (grace) reigns, it is God’s attitude. Everything is supported and sustained with another end in view. When you come to eternal life you have got [p. 428] to love.
DLH Grace is the way in which God adapts Himself to our need?
FER The idea in the New Testament is the quality in which God presents Himself to man.
DLH The moment you speak of love, you speak of God’s nature.
FER In love, God will satisfy Himself not what He will do for us. He will please Himself; that is the idea of love. You get the idea of sovereignty in love, which you do not get in grace. “The grace of God ... carries with it salvation for all men” (Titus 2:11), not to the elect.
DLH Grace paves the way for love.
FER Yes. The first acquaintance with God a man must have is in grace, because he is sinful and liable to judgment.
DLH Many people use the expression ‘love of God’ where they should speak of grace.
FER I think so; nine out of ten would not be able to distinguish between grace and love were they asked.
JSO Mr. Stoney used to speak of the ‘excess of grace’ in connection with the prodigal.
FER The prodigal knew the grace outside the house. God puts us in the heavenly places and gives a testimony to the universe of the exceeding riches of His grace. God has brought to pass the dominion of grace. You get the throne of grace and that has been brought to pass to enable God to carry out the purpose of His will.
JJ There would be no grace if there were no love.
FER The reign of grace is maintained really to enable God to carry out the purpose of His love. When Christ was here upon earth He came in grace, the world rejected Him and therefore rejected grace; but God brings out in Christ the rule of grace.
JSO What would be the contrast in the millennium, [p. 429] the reign of righteousness?
FER It is the reign of grace then, righteousness is there but grace reigns; that is why you find the world to come put under the Son of man for the dominion of grace.
DLH In the millennium the power is in the right hand to exercise righteousness.
FER That power is there now, but not publicly; it is there.
DLH In the millennium righteousness will reign because it will be in public exercise.
FER The power has its own particular character now. The grace of Christ is superior to all the spiritual influences of evil. When Christ takes the throne He will be superior to all the physical forces of evil; principalities and powers — all subject to Him. You can really confront all the forces of evil, that is the idea of grace now; hence “be strong in the grace which is in Christ Jesus”, 2 Timothy 2:1. It is for the maintenance of the testimony. I do not believe that infidelity would get rid of the testimony of God. God’s testimony will still be maintained here in spite of the character of things in the present day, science and the like. The power of grace will maintain that testimony here so long as God sees fit.
DLH I suppose the saints of God are liable to come under the various influences of today, if they are not going on with God?
FER I think so, “All that take the sword shall perish by the sword”, Matthew 26:52. We have to remember that.
Ques What do you mean by that?
FER If people go to work with carnal weapons they will be defeated with carnal weapons; therefore it is not wise to take to the sword, that is when Christ is in question.
JGK In Hebrews 4 grace is enthroned, is that carrying out the thought of its reigning?
FER I think [p. 430] so.
FC In what way do you come to the throne of grace?
FER In the sense of the soul.
F.C. Not prayer?
FER It is the sense in the soul that grace is in the ascendant. We are deficient in acquaintance with Christ; we want to get to Christ. I feel I have known about Christ a good deal, but I have known Himself so very little. You want to know Him; as the apostle puts it, “Be strong in the grace which is in Christ Jesus”, 2 Timothy 2:1. You will not be afraid then.
WB What is coming ‘boldly’ if it is not prayer?
FER You come to get it; you cannot fail to get it; it is not necessarily prayer.
ER Is it in regard to the heavenly calling? It is not general?
FER Yes.
DLH It is to help you out.
FER I think so.
JSO What do you mean by its not being general?
FER It is not only that all power belongs to Christ, but that there is a power down here commensurate to Christ. The great end is to be able to stand in the present day. You could not have the kingdom if there were not a power here commensurate with Christ. Power is an essential element for the kingdom. You must have a power here commensurate with Christ.
JSO You mean the Spirit of God?
FER Yes, it is such an immense mercy to know that the kingdom is maintained here by the power of God and that all the power of the enemy cannot dislodge it.
WB I do not doubt that at all.
DLH Righteousness, peace and joy, all of God, will be maintained.
FER Yes, in spite of the devil; but look how people are giving up scripture on every hand, and [p. 431] trying to fight the enemy with human weapons. I am not astonished at their defeat.
WJ What is the force of “He who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way”, 2 Thessalonians 2:7. Is that the Spirit?
FER Yes, the Spirit contemplates the principle of lawlessness coming into christianity. You get a hindering power. You get brought out here in our chapter the conditions, means and character of the ministers. You find these things in the change of prepositions. He brought out the character of the ministers and the means employed and the conditions of the ministry.
DLH There is the negative side and the positive, “giving no offence”, 2 Corinthians 6:3.
FER Yes, and then you get the means employed. It is all moral, no trickery. One thing in the passage which is important is the total absence of anything worldly, or human, in connection with the ministry.
DLH “As deceivers and yet true” (2 Corinthians 6:8) is character, I suppose?
FER I think so, He speaks of the character they had, but at the same time he presents the real power that was in them.
JSO This is a very good standard to measure by.
FER It is important to see the absence of worldly means; it does not present the idea of doing great things in the world. They were “unknown and yet well known”, 2 Corinthians 6:9.
WB But great things were done.
FER The fact is this, I am not quite sure whether we are good judges of great things; I fancy that many things which men think great are not at all great with God; and on the other hand, things men would not count great are very great with God.
JSO That is a sound principle.
ER Has verse 2 a direct application to the [p. 432] Lord Himself?
FER Yes. Paul gives a present application to what is strictly future. The accepted time and day of salvation is future, but it has a present application, so that you can turn the grace of God to account; you do not receive it in vain.
DLH What do you mean by great things, Mr. B.?
WB I mean great things were done by Paul in the power of the Spirit; for instance, his work at Ephesus.
FER Do you not think a greater thing was done at Philippi than at Ephesus?
WB I do not know. I quite go with your remark as to great things.
FER As to results, there never was a much greater thing done than what was done at Philippi.
JSO When you speak of Philippi, you mean the jailor?
FER Yes. The apostle’s heart went out to the Philippians more than to anybody. As regards Ephesus, it is where decline began. One really knows but very poorly how to measure things according to God.
JSO It is a comfort to know God’s judgment; some people preach away and do not see much result.
ED The Lord judged the poor widow in a different way from others.
FER He did; we judge of things as they come before us. He judges the ultimate results which we do not see at all.
WJ I do not think the apostle was ever grander than when at Philippi.
FER The great importance is the circumstance which brought him to Philippi; the vision of a man of Macedonia. I mark the results at Philippi by what comes out in the epistle. The true measure of a thing is the moral depth, not the superficial area. What comes out at the close of chapter 6 is that the saints [p. 433] could not get the benefit of the ministry, because they were not clear of associations. It is the same today; they do not get the benefit of the ministry, they are hindered by social links, etc. It is very remarkable the way in which he speaks of the saints here, of being in unequal yoke with unbelievers, etc. Believers are really described as ‘righteousness’, ‘light’, ‘Christ’, ‘believers’ and the ‘temple of God’; they were that here. They did not understand the gravity of it all, but all these things were presented in the saints; if they were here at all, they were in the saints, and so it is now.
JSO There is an important note in the New Translation to verse 14, ‘unequally’ is consequence but not stated in the text, which says ‘diversely’ referring to the levitical law, which forbade different animals to be yoked together; Deuteronomy 22: 10.
FER Exactly. The saints are not alive to what is expressed in them. We want the consciousness of what we are subjectively.
DLH You could not have the subjective if you had not the objective?
FER The true objective is really God; the subjective is the reflection of the objective. We have to meet things here with the subjective, not with the objective. If the Corinthians had been alive to what was expressed in them, they would not have tampered with things in the world. Everything is to be after the image of Him that created it. The Creator is objective, but image is subjective. It is like a man looking into a pool of water — he sees himself. The apostle wanted to awaken the saints at Corinth, as to what was expressed in them so that they should not maintain links inconsistent with it. Righteousness is the first lesson you learn about God.
DLH “I will dwell among them” (2 Corinthians 6:16) indicates the knowledge of God and the sense of His presence that God was there.
[p. 434] FER They know it in a way from covenant more than from the knowledge of God. They were not much in accord with God morally, but they had the Spirit and the manifestations of the Spirit were there.
DLH What does the apostle mean by chapter 5:11?
FER His first epistle had produced a moral effect; there was an awakening and the apostle could open his mouth as to the ministry; but we must not suppose that they were entering into it. He brings it before them, but it was for them to get disentangled. Holiness is the fruit of love; love is of God. There is no trouble about holiness, if love is promoted. People try to get holiness without love, so that it is a very spurious holiness.
JGK Is “I will dwell among them” (2 Corinthians 6:16) on the lines of the new covenant?
FER I think it goes beyond it. God establishes the covenant that He may dwell. God could not dwell except on certain terms, and the new covenant gives the terms in order that God may dwell. He dwells now in a way and literally by-and-by. If God dwells now, then there must be in us what is suitable to Him.
Ques Is the temple in verse 16 in contrast with the habitation?
FER The temple goes farther and brings in the thought of glory. Habitation is where everything is ordered by the Spirit.
JSO More connected with spiritual worship?
FER Yes. Where God is contemplated and approached.
EC The temple is connected with the rest of God.
FER I think so. In verse 1 of chapter 7 we get the exhortation. I am certain that if people are not free in regard of associations they will make no progress at all in divine things.
[p. 435] JSO You cannot help getting on the level of the people you associate with.
FER You cannot help being affected by them; separation may appear harsh with some people, but down here it is an absolute necessity for any one who is going on with God.
DLH The call to Abraham was to separation.
FER Yes, the fact is this, God knows the world and the effect of influences upon His people better than we do, and He is wiser than us and it is therefore better to take the path He has indicated.
Ques What do you mean by associations?
FER I mean all kinds of associations, domestic and business, too; every association. People keep up social intimacy and business engagements and the like but if you take a partner in business, I think you have to be careful who your partner is going to be; the same holds good if one marries, one has to be careful as to the domestic ties.