FATHERHOOD (5)
[p. 454] FATHERHOOD (5)
Genesis 37: 2, 3; Genesis 46: 1 - 7; Genesis 48: 10 - 22; Genesis 49: 1, 2
JT We finished our previous meeting by reading the reference in chapter 28 to Jacob as moving under orders — under the direction of his father and mother, a matter of which Esau took note. He took note of the fact that Jacob obeyed his parents. The prime thought for Jacob was that he should escape the murderous fury of his brother, and Rebecca suggested that he should go to her brother Laban in Padan-Aram and abide with him some days. He went, and remained many years, and became the father of a large family. We have to consider a little the circumstances of his marriage and the development of his family, that we may see how the light broke in at the advent of Joseph. For he began to move after Joseph was born, and Joseph was in a special position right through, as if he were the saving element in Jacob’s soul and in his family relationships; implying that fathers and mothers in circumstances that are oppressive are only safe as they allow Christ a place in their minds — a guiding place — an influential place; otherwise there can only be disaster. So that we have to consider for a moment the circumstances; they were largely mercenary, though there was love; Jacob loved Rachel, but we cannot say much more; the circumstances were largely mercenary. He had to bring up his family as a wage earner. It says his wages were changed ten times, and part of those wages were his wives, a degrading element in itself. He had to purchase his wives by labour, as it says in Hosea 12: 12, “for a wife he kept sheep”. In all this there is a great deal of instruction for us, especially as in the great industrial, metropolitan cities in which the saints now nearly all reside. In such places it is a great question as to wages, and bringing up our families, and how we are to get through, whether we make room for Christ.
[p. 455] Joseph was born in Padan-Aram, and immediately Jacob thought of moving from there, but even then he did not go; he was hampered for a while because of wages.
AEH Is there a danger of using our wages to attempt to establish ourselves in a kind of social status that will enable us to marry better socially, and thereby a social stratum of things springs up in the assembly?
JT Well, if wages have a leading influence and thought in our lives we may be sure that that sort of thing will develop, for with the rise of wages we have the increase of worldly possibilities, larger houses, larger and better cars, and so forth. So that the eleventh son of Jacob had to be waited for; before he came there was no movement. God would say, You have to wait for Joseph. It was not through the other sons that blessing came. They were born under very distressing circumstances, circumstances of fleshly feeling and rivalry.
SMcC God raises this matter of wages with the remnant who were paying far more attention to their own houses than to the house of God. Haggai 1: 6 says that “he that earneth wages earneth wages for a bag with holes”.
JT A bag with holes is not a safe place for wages! But we have a large matter on hand when we talk about industrialism and wages, and how we are built up in a worldly sense; whether we bring the subject up in connection with this country or other countries; but especially so in this one. What difficulties the Spirit of God has with us on account of wages! So that we must have clearly in mind how Christ in type came into Jacob’s mind and influenced him and delivered him. Look at Genesis 30: 25, “And it came to pass when Rachel had borne Joseph, that Jacob said to Laban, Send me away, that I may go to my place and to my country”. That was his first thought after Joseph was [p. 456] born. Clearly Joseph had a special place, indeed he superseded the rest of the family. That is confirmed in chapter 33, where in the presentation of Jacob’s family Joseph is placed in a safer position than his brothers. It says in verse 7 of chapter 33, “And lastly Joseph drew near, and Rachel”. He is put before his mother, as if that was the place that Joseph had in his father’s mind; he was the saving element. And so in our chapter we have the statement in verse 2, “These are the generations of Jacob. Joseph, being seventeen years old;” and in verse 3, “Israel loved Joseph more than all his sons, because he was son of his old age; and he made him a vest of many colours”. It seems to me that there is a great lesson in this section in regard to industrial matters. How bound up we are in spite of ourselves and how Satan would hold us by legal influences in industry; that is, by unionism, and prevent the work of the Spirit of God in us, and deprive us of our spiritual liberty!
JWD What do you think should be our attitude towards having to work on the Lord’s day?
JT Well, the attitude would be that if we have Joseph clearly in our minds we should prefer not to do it, because it interferes with our service to God, and with our spiritual growth. The first day of the week has such a place and Joseph has such a place in our hearts, that, because it is Joseph’s day — the Lord’s day — we do not want to deprive Him of what He is looking for; He is looking to have us.
JWD I was wondering whether if that were our general attitude, and pursued in prayer before God, the authorities would protect us in that regard. Do you think we could count on that? I mean, that they might bring in enactments that would set us free.
JT Just so. Prayer is the thing we began with this morning — entreaty. Now this is a matter that interferes with Joseph; it is the Lord’s day; and while there cannot [p. 457] be a doubt that the early christians had to work on the first day of the week, yet now that this day is recognised, to go back to that has the character of apostasy. The rights of the Lord stand connected with the Lord’s supper, and the service of God develops out of it, so that the Lord looks for us to be there. The danger of wages and income influencing us is what we must watch. The next question is, How are we to be there?
AEH Do you think the love that Jacob had for Joseph, because he was the son of his old age, might suggest the thought of Christ getting the first place with us? We are disillusioned in our old days; other things have not been fruitful so that we then turn to Christ, whereas Christ ought to get the best of our lives.
JT That is the point. I think we are to learn from Jacob — how he developed in his old age. He progressed in his old age because of the influence that Joseph had upon him after he learned that Joseph was in Egypt. There was a steady growth of soul after he reached Joseph in Egypt. The Lord does not care much for persons turning over to these things after they have used their best days to make money. Someone has said, ‘Youth is a mistake, manhood a struggle, and old age a regret’. It was not so with Jacob, but it is so with men of this world. Youth is not a mistake with the saints; in youth we must begin to do what is right, the Spirit helping us. And why should we struggle in middle age? God will help us in it. So also in old age, God will help us, as He helped Jacob, to increase in power and in service toward God.
ASB In relation to working on the Lord’s day, there is an allurement in it. The authorities must recognise there is something in it, because they pay double time for that day.
JT Yes, the enemy would promote it so as to rob God. The day is recognised and it has been recognised in christendom since far back into early centuries. [p. 458] To abandon it now is wrong, we do not want to do that. We want to make it clear that we recognise and respect the Lord’s day.
AR In the days of Nehemiah when he saw persons buying and selling and trading with the men of Tyre in Jerusalem on the sabbath, he put the young men and Levites at every gate to keep them out.
JT Very good. When we come to the Lord’s day it is a question of His rights. Let us at least give Him one day. We have working time for six days, but at the beginning of the week we lay claim to one day — figuratively the sabbath, now the first day of the week — for the Lord. We should be the first to recognise that day at whatever cost it may be.
TLS Even to losing one’s position?
JT It is hardly the place of legislation here, but it is a question of getting the principle as to where we are. What place has Christ in me, where is He in my mind? If He has come in only in our old age, there is not much in that.
SMcC Do you not think there is great wisdom needed in the way this matter is approached, both with those under whom we work, and those with whom we work? Instead of arbitrarily refusing to work, should we not seek to lay down the position and our regard for the Lord and His day and His rights in a way that will cause them to see it is necessary that we should not work? Do you not think that is important?
JT I think it is a good way to put it. When Nehemiah appeared before the king, after he had heard about the desolation of Jerusalem, the king noticed his countenance and inquired why it was so sad. If I am pleased with the excess salary, my countenance will hardly be sad, but if my employers and superiors see that I am sorry, because I am missing the first day of the week, it may impress them and they may recognise me. The point at the present time is not me, but it is conscience,
[p. 459] and affection for Christ in me. We are not to have mixed motives.
ASB Do you think that is in mind in Zechariah 14: 21, in relation to Jerusalem? “And in that day there shall be no more a Canaanite in the house of Jehovah of hosts”. The footnote says, merchant.
JT Yes. Undoubtedly the character of the Canaanite was merchandising, and Joseph became a chattel in that world; he was bought and sold as a slave. We are to be afraid of that sort of thing; the Canaanite needs to be driven out. We can see that in Jacob’s natural outlook as a young man, head of a family, he had that spirit to some extent, the desire to accumulate plenty of money, and so he became a rich man by the time he reached middle age. We need to scrutinise our motives; is it that I have a certain amount of conscience, but am willing to divert from it a little? Have I a thought of gaining some little advantage as long as my conscience is eased?
SMcC It is a great test, is it not, as to the reality of our links with God, and with Christ? Take this industrial city — some of us are aliens; also we cannot belong to the union, and we do not work on the Lord’s day. All these things test the reality of our links with God and with Christ.
JT Yes, indeed; those living in this city are qualified to tell us about that. You may be sure that you, here where industrialism is so paramount, have the deepest sympathy of the brethren. What have such as we, a few christians, to say to that condition? The Lord would value the faithfulness shown in it, the place Joseph has in our hearts, and movement out with Him in spirit so as to be with the Lord on His day.
HGH What bearing on our subject has this report that Joseph brings?
JT Well, we might proceed now in our subject,
[p. 460] and note that Jacob is an old man before there is reference to his generations. Chapter 37 says, “These are the generations of Jacob”, verse 2, but reference to them in detail is deferred until we come to chapter 46, so that the Spirit of God might disclose some specific conditions in his family. Then we come in verse 8 of that chapter to the sentence, “And these are the names of the sons of Israel who came into Egypt”. Between chapters 37 and 46 eve have harrowing experiences; most sorrowful things occurred in Jacob’s house. One thing to be noted in chapter 37 is that Joseph was with the sons of Bilhah and Zilpah, his father’s wives, and brought to his father an evil report of them. That is, mention is made of these brothers of Joseph, and that they were evidently of corrupted minds. Their mothers were not wives properly, though their position in the family is accepted; yet they are not the sons of Leah or Rachel. They have been brought up under poor motherly influence; that is one thing to notice, and Jacob is responsible in it.
ASB Why is it that when Abraham’s name is changed from Abram there is never a reverting to the use of the old name, even in the New Testament; whereas after God had said to Jacob in Genesis 32: 28, “Thy name shall not henceforth be called Jacob, but Israel;” it still speaks in chapter 37 of “the generations of Jacob;” and when Jehovah speaks in chapter 46 He says, “Jacob, Jacob!”?
JT I think He is telling him that it is a question of his responsible position as not yet having moved out to Joseph in Egypt. Joseph in Egypt is now the object to be understood, and what comes out is that they all went down with Jacob, according to the paragraph beginning with verse 8. Then in verse 26, “All the souls that came with Jacob to Egypt, that had come out of his loins, besides Jacob’s sons’ wives: all the souls were sixty-six. And the sons of Joseph who were [p. 461] born to him in Egypt, were two souls. All the souls of the house of Jacob that came to Egypt were seventy”. I think his responsibility is carried through and the nearer we get to the end the more apparent it is. The name Israel is there too, the spiritual side is maintained right through. Hence we have just read in verse 8, “And these are the names of the sons of Israel who came into Egypt;” and then in chapter 49, “Jacob called his sons, and said, Gather yourselves together, and I will tell you what will befall you at the end of days. Assemble yourselves, and hear, ye sons of Jacob, And listen to Israel your father”. So that the responsible and spiritual features are both carried through.
JWB In chapter 36 we have the generations of Esau which are many, a large list which includes the whole chapter; but in chapter 37, the generations of Jacob, we have only one son mentioned. Is that in keeping with the line that goes through? With Abraham also there is only one mentioned — Isaac.
JT Properly, Abraham’s generations are not given. Isaac’s are and Jacob’s are, but Abraham’s generations are not specified, because he represents the heavenly man. It is what takes place on earth really that is in mind in the word generations. So that here we have Joseph mentioned and nothing more until we come to chapter 46. Why is that? Clearly, it is that Joseph should be brought before our minds in all his greatness, both moral and official, and that Jacob, indeed his whole family, should go into Egypt in the full light of Joseph, in the knowledge that Joseph is supreme. In chapter 37, one of the first things that comes out is Joseph’s supremacy over his brothers, and then his supremacy over even his father and mother, seen in the sun, moon and eleven stars. These were his dreams and his brothers hated him because of them. His father complained about them, but he observed them, and he had to come into the understanding of them. As the greatness [p. 462] of Christ grows in my soul other things become less and less. His position is to be my position, that is the lesson I must learn; I cannot make Joseph fit into my circumstances, I must come into his. Jacob had to come to this.
JWD Do you not think that difficult brothers with whom we have had to do in our own histories have brought out God’s infinite, merciful consideration for us, going on with us in grace? Should not that be our general attitude until Joseph is supreme?
JT Well, we cannot walk with them. They sold Joseph into Egypt, and they have to go through things. It is a question of experience now from chapter 37 to chapter 46. Joseph is only seventeen years of age in chapter 37, but he is going to be a father; how is he going to acquire the place that belongs to him? When the culmination is reached he says, “God ... has made me a father to Pharaoh”, chapter 45: 8. What an immense elevation that is! He comes into fellowship as a young man, and he is to be a father; what a challenge that is to the hearts of our young brothers and sisters! They are to become real fathers in their youth, a powerful influence among the brethren even in their youth.
CAM Would Timothy be a similar instance of prophetic suggestion as to his future? Joseph’s dreams gave him a prophetic inkling as to what God was going to do.
JT Quite so. He had prophetic indication and the eleven brothers were also to have it. We have to take a long view here as to Jacob’s wife, for Rachel had already died, and to regard the wifely position in an abstract way. The first dream is an agricultural figure. Joseph’s sheaf standing up and the others bowing down, but the second is a heavenly and administrative dream. There is plenty of light conveyed in that dream. Let us walk in that light, in the power of it, and understand what it means. Joseph is not [p. 463] coming into my circumstances, but I am coming into his.
WL Would you say that in that way he really becomes a father to his brethren and to his own father morally?
JT He does indeed. He says, I have become a father to Pharaoh. God had made him that, it was by divine appointment.
TLS Does that regulate our attendance at the meetings? Perhaps we are inclined to regulate our attendance by our circumstances rather than regulating our circumstances by the meetings.
JT Well, that is the way to reach it. John was on the isle of Patmos, but he was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, despite his circumstances.
RWS Is the moral exercise Joseph went through in Egypt particularly important, in that he early developed in manhood so that he could become a father?
JT Exercise would characterise Joseph, and his development would mean in the antitype that Christ is growing in our affections. He is seventeen years old when he leaves home, and after this short period he is a father to Pharaoh, according to the message he sent back to his own father. He says, God has made me that to Pharaoh; and later of Ephraim and Manasseh, “They are my sons, whom God has given me here”. He is a man who has learned to give God His place. The Lord Jesus has come here in order to give joy to God’s heart, and He should be in our hearts; that is the lesson to be learned.
SMcC This feature of fatherhood that you are stressing in Joseph would be very important in regard to government and administration among us, because the tendency is always that it should become arbitrary and academic, whereas fatherhood would bring some kind of feeling into it. Isaiah 22: 21 says of Eliakim, “he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem”. God committed the government to the one there.
[p. 464] Are government and administration tempered by the feelings of fatherhood in that way?
JT That is very good. The well-known passage in Isaiah 9, “his name is called ... Father of Eternity”, tells what a Father Jesus was. What influence He asserted! He was actually young here in a scene of evil, but He was a Father. It is well to take note of these things because we should as young men develop in fatherhood, and gain the confidence of the brethren. God will put us there if we are on these lines, and a man cannot be overthrown if God puts him into that position.
SMcC I was thinking of the tendency of those of us who are younger to force issues through, whereas fatherhood would imply influence in any matter so that the brethren are carried.
JT Quite so.
RWS Paul said to Timothy, “Rebuke not an elder sharply”. Would you say a word as to that?
JT That is a good word for young men. Have respect for the elder brethren, elder in the sense of ruling persons. You have respect for such, you would not speak sharply to them.
AR After His resurrection the Lord said to His disciples on the sea shore, “Children, have ye anything to eat?” John 21: 5 — a fine example of the fatherly feelings of the Lord Jesus even to the brother who was leading the disciples astray.
JT You can see how they would understand that title, “Father of Eternity”, conveying the great power of Christ. To refer to Joseph again, when his brother Benjamin comes Joseph says, “God be gracious to thee, my son”, although he was only a few years older than Benjamin. Observe the greatness of Joseph; what God had made him, and what is laid open to us!
ASB While Joseph had no influence with his brethren in chapter 37 because of negative conditions there, is it not interesting that when he goes into [p. 465] Egypt he begins to exert great influence there? And it says he is “of a beautiful countenance;” a beautiful ornament in the house of Potiphar, a good influence in Egypt.
JT God did things for him. God is doing things now, wonderful things, if we could only see them and dwell on them.
JRH Would it be right to say that the fatherhood of Christ merges in the fatherhood of God, that it has that in view in His dealings with His people?
JT The fatherhood of Christ can never replace the fatherhood of God, because there is only one “God the Father”. The name Father is unlimited save that He judges no one, whereas “Father of Eternity” is limited. It refers to the Lord, and is simply to bring out His moral greatness here on the earth; His resurrection is to remind us of it, and the allusion in the name is to what there will be in the millennial day. How great the need is for it when we consider what there is now — independency, men doing as they wish. When Christ comes in He does the will of His Father and He is an influence that cannot be set aside. Fatherhood is there. We often use the expression of brothers, saying, He is a real father. It is based on what the brother is. I do not know whether that is clear. I should not like in any way to minimise the statement that He is “the Father of Eternity”, but it really means ‘the Father of the age;’ it is a limited thought, but it is one of the glories of Christ.
CAM Would you think that new creation in the end of Isaiah hardly takes you beyond the millennium? Indeed the book hardly takes you beyond that point.
JT Yes. If you just confine yourself to what is in Isaiah it would not go beyond the millennium. “I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy” (Isaiah 65: 18), that is what is in mind; but new creation in the New Testament goes beyond [p. 466] that.
WL Would you say that Joseph acquires the place of father through sufferings?
JT That is the way the facts are stated. Joseph in chapter 37 is the only generation of Jacob so far, and we have to wait for him to be glorified in Egypt before the idea proceeds. Then according to his dreams both Jacob and all the family go down into Egypt, in the light, too; so that they are going into his circumstances, he is not going into theirs. Joseph sent waggons to his father and brought them to Egypt, and as Jacob drew nigh his son Joseph went out to meet him and “presented himself to him”.
JWD This thought of Christ glorified in Egypt is not Christ glorified in heaven, is it?
JT No; the literal application would be to Jewish christians in early days, how they were to move out of Jewish settings to Christ glorified among the nations. So that the mystery is “Christ in you” (that is the gentiles) “the hope of glory” (Colossians 1: 27), and all the Jews are to come to that. Jerusalem was destroyed and the faithful had to come out into that position. But in a moral way each of us has to learn to come into Joseph’s position — his circumstances. That is what happened to Israel as seen in Genesis 46: 8 “Jacob and his sons” went to Joseph.
CAM The land of Goshen would in type be the place of the assembly at the present time, would it not?
JT Just so, Joseph’s provision for us.
AR In the beginning of chapter 46 Jacob “came to Beer-sheba; and offered sacrifices to the God of his father Isaac”, and God appeared to him as the God of his father. Typically he was moving from earthly circumstances to heavenly circumstances — to the God of his father Isaac.
JT That is right. It is remarkable in chapter 46 that Abraham is not the point, but Isaac; that [p. 467] is, Christ risen; so that now Jacob is in accord with that and God confirms it, and it is said that he offered sacrifices to the God of his father Isaac. That was the state of his soul at that time, he was recognising Isaac. “And God spoke to Israel in the visions of the night and said, Jacob, Jacob! And he said, Here am I. And he, said, I am God, the God of thy father”. God is confirming the light he had in his soul, and then He goes on, “fear not to go down to Egypt; for I will there make of thee a great nation”. That is, the growth will be there. “I will go down with thee to Egypt, and I will also certainly bring thee up; and Joseph shall put his hand on thine eyes”. Joseph is always in front — “Joseph shall put his hand on thine eyes”.
JRH What does that mean?
JT It means that Jacob’s eyes are henceforth to be directed by Joseph. What things we see among the gentiles according to the great epistle to the Romans! What glories have been opened up to us! Instead of Jerusalem, it is Rome. So Paul says, “the Lord stood with me, and gave me power, that through me the preaching might be fully made” (2 Timothy 4: 17). I would take it that way, that Jacob’s eyes are under Joseph’s.
AP It is remarkable that this feature of consideration for the father should be brought out so much in Joseph’s exercise as over against the jealousy of his brothers. In chapter 45 he says, “Does my father yet live?”
JT It is most interesting to keep before us at this point the fatherhood of Joseph. It is elected fatherhood in a young man; he puts his hands upon our eyes. And now when we come to the final passage in chapter 48 we have Joseph and Jacob together. A new lesson is opened up here, that the fatherhood of Jacob is greater morally than that of Joseph, for a son can never be greater than his father. Now the fatherhood of Jacob is seen in the remarkable power he has from God, what [p. 468] God has given him in his old age to change the status of the families of certain ones, and that over the direct head of the immediate father of those two. So that we might say it is the only error of Joseph that we can find, as if God would emphasise how the faith is maintained in the three — Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Although Joseph was a father to Pharaoh, he could never be a father to Jacob, he could never be greater than Jacob. It was not the divine mind; the divine mind and God’s plans can never be thwarted.
RWS Will you enlarge a little on your remark that a son can never be greater than his father?
JT The very term carries the thought itself.
JRH The Lord Jesus could say, “My Father is greater than I”, John 14: 28.
JT Well, ostensibly the Father must be greater than the Son. It is a question of the economy, not the abstract relation.
JWW Malachi 1: 6 says, “a son honoureth his father”, carrying the same idea.
JT Just so. Some in recent years say you can transpose the positions of the Son and the Father in verse 19 of Matthew 28; that you might say Son and Father are interchangeable. But it is the reversion of the truth. Father, Son, and Holy Spirit implies the truth of christianity. That is the relative position that divine Persons have taken, and you cannot interfere with that.
AEH So that if a natural son moves ahead of his father spiritually, the son in reality would be the father. Would you go so far as that?
JT Well, he could never be in the mind of God officially greater than his father, because father and son is a fixed divine thought, a family thought. God has in mind the Father, Son and Spirit and that cannot be reversed. The status of a man as father can never be taken by the son, that is, while his father [p. 469] lives.
WL Is that why we get the name Israel in this connection and not Jacob?
JT Israel is seen here in his fulness of spiritual power, and God is bringing to our attention that the great man of Egypt has to be negated by Jacob. Let us listen to what he says: “When Joseph saw that his father laid his right hand on the head of Ephraim, it was evil in his eyes; and he took hold of his father’s hand to remove it from Ephraim’s head to Manasseh’s head. And Joseph said to his father, Not so, my father, for this is the firstborn: put thy right hand on his head. But his father refused and said, I know, my son, I know: he also will become a people, and he also will be great; but truly his younger brother will be greater than he; and his seed will become the fulness of nations”, verses 17 - 19. “His father refused”, notice that word. It is a real altercation between Joseph and Jacob. There had never been one before, but there is one now. Jacob says, “I know, my son, I know”. Can he change that? Jacob knows what he is doing as a father, as the father, and Joseph has to recognise that. Jacob does not alter his hands because Joseph wishes it; he goes on to say, “he also will become a people, and he also will be great; but truly his younger brother will be greater than he; and his seed will become the fulness of nations. And he blessed them that day, saying, In thee will Israel bless, saying, God make thee as Ephraim and Manasseh! And he set Ephraim before Manasseh”. You see, he is doing it; let no one interfere. Morally no one can interfere. If it were an Egyptian, Joseph’s word would be law; but not now; it is his father. God is asserting His own counsel, His own rights, and Jacob is the father; he is morally suitable. He says in effect, Your will in this matter does not carry; I know what I am doing and it must go through.
TLS Have we not often been deluded by the idea that to be fatherly is to be nice to everyone? But I [p. 470] understand that here Jacob is showing power in doing what is right.
JT Yes, power goes with the father. That is how the Lord is said to be “Father of Eternity;” His word stands. It is the moral power of what He is.
JC The eyes of Jacob being dimmed, and not being able to see, would show his superiority over what was natural, would it not?
JT Yes, he knew in spite of natural disability, what he was doing. It is a fine finish. Then the next thing is, “listen to Israel your father”, chapter 49: 2. That chapter begins: “And Jacob called his sons, and said, Gather yourselves together, and I will tell you what will befall you at the end of days. Assemble yourselves, and hear, ye sons of Jacob, and listen to Israel your father”. Joseph could not say this; Joseph could not utter what we have in this chapter, it is Jacob. Joseph has to be among his brethren and answer the summons to “Gather yourselves together”. Now he is attentive to his father and Jacob is going to tell them the history of the family in a prophetic word. He is not going to hide anything. The true father is here; he is not covering over anything that the children have done. Now the whole truth is told out; that enters into the idea of the father, the real father.
HB In Acts 20 Paul calls the elders of Ephesus to tell them what would befall them after his departure. Would that be like this?
JT The fatherhood is very beautiful here. God would finish this great life of Jacob by stressing fatherhood at the end, even over Joseph; great man though he was, he has to hearken to Israel his father.
JWD Do you mean that however much we develop in the idea of fatherhood we always have to maintain the idea of being sons as well; so that we should be constantly ready to be adjusted by the greater and more supreme idea of [p. 471] fatherhood?
JT Exactly. God graciously develops a fatherly condition among the saints, and whatever comes in, it is our wisdom to bow to it.
WL Is the same thought in Matthew 24: 36 when the Lord says, “But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of the heavens, but my Father alone”?
JT Yes, that is a good scripture. Everything is reserved for the Father. So the Lord speaks in Acts 1: 7 of the times or seasons “which the Father has placed in his own authority”.
JWD That would deliver us from anything national in the idea of a father, a supreme brother in a country or continent, would it not?
JT Quite so. It is an immense thing to have a fatherly quality in any gathering. There are “not many fathers”, says Paul. Where that quality exists it is our wisdom to bow to it.
SMcC Is the thought that, however much fatherhood may develop in younger men, as in Joseph, it always has to make room for experience as set out in Jacob? It can never take the place of experience, the side that Jacob sets out.
JT Yes, that is it. Long experience in Jacob has developed into this. It is said when Joseph came to see him that “Israel strengthened himself ... . And Jacob said to Joseph, The Almighty God appeared to me at Luz in the land of Canaan, and blessed me”. He tells Joseph what he had gone through and goes on to say, “And as for me, when I came from Padan, Rachel died by me in the land of Canaan on the way, when there was yet a certain distance to come to Ephrath; and I buried her there on the way to Ephrath, that is, Bethlehem”. He is bringing out his experience. What experiences he had! And now the product of that experience is here and he is greater than Joseph, greater than any moral or any official [p. 472] weight that the son could have. God sees to it that Jacob is the father in this circumstance.
HGH Do these verses in chapter 49 remind us of the authority in connection with fatherhood?
JT The blessing of Jacob here is the blessing of a man of authority, though given as a father. He is appealing to his children and calls to them: “Assemble yourselves, and hear, ye sons of Jacob”.
AR “What will befall you at the end of days”. He is not talking experimentally now in regard of his own experience, but covering their whole history. What he says has not been fulfilled yet, has it?
JT Well, I think it is wonderful that Jacob is the prophet. I might say he is the outstanding prophet in the book of Genesis. God said, “Do my prophets no harm” (Psalm 105: 15). Jacob is included among them. What an opening out of the mind of God we have here! All this history is linked up with the twelve sons of Jacob and they are to hear it pronounced. In some cases their own shame has to be rehearsed in their ears.
AR You might say Jacob uses great liberty in crossing his hands in regard to Ephraim and Manasseh; but he is really changing the position of his hands in relation to his whole twelve sons, is he not?
JT Quite so. He is asserting the spiritual will, and that over against the suggestion of Joseph that he should change the position of those hands. If the position of those hands is changed we go back to the world, from the spiritual to the natural, but Israel says, “I know, my son”. Jacob says in effect it cannot be otherwise, or the purposes of God will not go through.
Ques Would not the record of chapter 50 show that Joseph has been adjusted? He ends the matter himself in regard of his sons and great-grandsons, putting Ephraim first, verse 23.
JT That is a good remark. It finishes our subject. I had thought of finishing with Joseph. In chapter 41 [p. 473] he tells us what God had done for him; he named his sons according to his own experiences and circumstances. Now he is 110 years old, and he is to die. He saw Ephraim’s children to the third generation and you have in mind that he confirms all that we have been saying. Ephraim is mentioned first. Joseph is a real father; even to the third generation he is still a father.
JC Why does this idea of fatherhood culminate with Jacob? This blessing of the family surpasses that of Isaac and Abraham.
JT It is because he was the third: Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob; three is the principle with God. It is the end of an exercise beginning with Abraham, so that the thing culminates in Jacob through most extraordinary experiences and exercises.
JWW When Israel blesses Joseph in chapter 49 he alludes to “the God of thy father, and he will help thee; And from the Almighty, and he will bless thee;” and later, “The blessings of thy father surpass the blessings of my ancestors”. Would that emphasise the thought of fatherhood as making room for Christ?
JT It has been remarked, and it is well to keep it in mind, that Joseph is now thoroughly in the truth. Chapter 50, verse 1, says, “And Joseph fell upon his father’s face, and wept upon him, and kissed him”. It is a beautiful finish of the setting sun, of the father. What a glorious prospect is in view! What a day is to burst upon us! The light concentrated here will burst u on us in answer to it all, the great thoughts and purposes of God.
JRH Would Paul’s tears link up with Joseph’s tears in his relations with his brethren in fatherhood?
JT Just so.
AR Is the lesson from these meetings that everyone of us should be concerned about making a way for the counsels and purposes of God among us, to see that they are going [p. 474] through?
JT Yes. To see that they should go through characteristically, that we are not holding the truth objectively, but going through with the Spirit. What came to my mind at the beginning of these meetings was that we are to be set in relation to a great mission. The Holy Spirit was sent from heaven and, as here on earth, He was commissioned; the commission was continued in the Holy Spirit, and we are to go through corresponding characteristically with the purposes and counsels of God; so that what goes into heaven is equal to what came out of heaven.
SMcC The last word of Joseph is beautiful. It says, “And Joseph took an oath of the children of Israel, saying, God will certainly visit you; and ye shall carry up my bones hence”. That is the last word — the ark with his bones.
JT Quite so. The ark with his bones was the constant testimony among Israel of things that were to happen later in relation to those bones. The framework would come out later, God will put flesh on them and breathe into them, and spirit will be put into them, and the whole mind of God will stand out effectively here.