THE GIFTS: WHEN GIVEN, HOW KNOWN; INSIDE THE ASSEMBLY OR OUTSIDE
[p. 273] THE GIFTS: WHEN GIVEN, HOW KNOWN; INSIDE THE ASSEMBLY OR OUTSIDE
JBS To begin with, we must distinguish between gift and conversion. I do not think it follows that a gift is given at conversion.
Ques Would Paul be an exception?
JBS He did not get all his gift then. He was a minister of the church as well as an evangelist. I conclude he got the latter first. The Lord says, “I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee”, Acts 26: 16.
F.H.B. What is a gift?
JBS Something given to you at a definite time for a definite purpose.
WW Have we in Scripture permanent and temporary gifts?
JBS I do not think so; though the Spirit of God might move a man, and never afterwards move him again.
ED Would you say a word about the distinction between natural ability and gift?
JBS Natural ability has nothing to do with gift. A gift is some distinct impression which is given of Christ.
If you ask for an illustration, the burning bush is given to Moses, and the man with the drawn sword to Joshua. A gifted man can always go back to the impression with which he started.
DLH A person may receive a gift at conversion, but not enter upon the exercise of it?
JBS Quite so, there is sometimes in a man that which answers to what they call a bearing in a coal mine.
[p. 274] There is so much of the world in him that his gift does not come out.
Timothy was to stir up the gift of God which was in him. Evidently he received his gift in the assembly, by the laying on of hands. You must be walking in the power of the Spirit to be in the power of your gift. The apostle Paul was highly accomplished, no doubt; but what we find is, that there was given to him a thorn for the flesh - probably impediment in speech. Notwithstanding this, his gift came out in greater power.
There have been times when I have tried to be eloquent, and I did not increase in power. Often the word you think least of is most used. If you speak mentally, you will exhilarate your hearers; if you speak spiritually, you will subdue them. A man who has been reached by the ministry of the word likes to be off by himself. He is like a wounded stag - he gets to the corner of the field. I believe the effort to imitate another man’s gift never prospers.
EC Imitation is the ruin of the church of God.
JBS I think a striking example in Scripture as to when gift is given is in John 20; it is there we get all the characteristics of the assembly, though it is not actually set up. One is, “As my Father hath sent me, even so send I you”.
The fact of a man having converts through his ministry, is not of itself a proof that he has a gift. If it were so, then many a woman would have gift, for many have been blessed in conversions.
FHB I thought an evangelist was a man who was to carry the gospel and preach it.
JBS Paul was an evangelist to the jailor; the man is converted, he then presents to him the good tidings.
I believe an evangelist is one who comes from the Lord with good tidings. What characterises him is that he is the bearer of [p. 275] good tidings.
Ques Was the jailor converted?
JBS Conversion is simply the soul turned to God; the first point of it is misery; and the evangelist comes in to relieve the misery, though it is true a wicked man hearing the gospel might be affected by it.
FHB Strictly speaking, you would say an evangelist is a bearer of glad tidings.
JBS That is what characterises him.
Ques Do we not find Paul, though an evangelist, reasoning of righteousness and judgment to come?
FER The evangelist, whilst characterised as a bearer of good tidings, to minister to the needy, would not pass over the state of man as it presents itself. Paul’s spirit was stirred in him when he saw the city of Athens given to idolatry. If you went among the heathen. you could not perhaps begin with the gospel; you might have first to seek to convince them there was a God. Paul preached as glad tidings repentance toward God, and faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. Repentance is the door opened of God in grace. He has given repentance, it is of the glad tidings; there would be no repentance if God had not opened the door. It is as much the grace of God in giving repentance as in giving forgiveness of sins - the word of the glad tidings is connected with repentance.
WW What is meant by “He led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men”?
JBS J.N.D. used to say gift was above all the power of evil down here, the devil or anything else. This passage holds good to this day; the Lord can give gifts now.
AH A person might teach without being apt to teach, that is, really possessed of the gift of a teacher.
JBS Everything is Christ’s, and He gives these gifts according to His pleasure; there is more gift in the church than people imagine. Many confine fruit to conversions. I do not. The greatest fruit unto God is souls growing up unto Christ. I believe the [p. 276] great good of ministry is to the end that you may be established; Romans 1: 11. In 1 Corinthians 12 we have no mention of evangelists, because the subject is the assembly, and therefore it is the gifts inside.
Ques Are the gifts in 1 Corinthians 12 viewed more as the gifts of the Spirit, and the gifts in Ephesians 4 looked at more as the gifts of Christ?
FER I have thought that gifts were only given from the Christ once, that is, when He ascended up on high, He “gave gifts unto men”. In 1 Corinthians 12 we see the gifts placed under the distribution of the Spirit, only the men are marked out of the Lord; it is a great point to see the power in which the gifts were given. Gifts are special favours - they are looked at as marks of His victory. It is when Christ has ascended up “far above all heavens” that He gave, and therefore what is bestowed must (in that sense) be superior to everything that is against it.
DLH If a man has a gift, may we not say he has it from the Head?
FER It must come from the Head; but all that is given comes under the distribution of the Spirit. I think when the Spirit was given, everything was given to the church. It was then endowed - the gifts are Christ’s endowment.
When the church has lost all sense of the presence of the Spirit, you do not get in the same way the benefit of the gifts.
Ques What about the gifts mentioned in Romans 12?
JBS There we come on to what is more general. My impression is that everyone has something from the Lord to do for Him. There is no scripture perhaps so little understood as that verse in 2 Corinthians 5, “And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again”. You belong to the Person who died for you.
[p. 277] WW I have often been humbled to think how we look to God for the smallest things instead of the greatest - we are prone to limit God.
THR It is an immense thing for us, in looking at the gifts, to see that they are to subserve Christ’s interests and purpose. All of them are for the accomplishment of that; and the telling out of what God is.
JBS If a man has a certain gift, he cannot change it. We sometimes see those who have had the gift of an evangelist, and after a time have settled down in a place, and tried to teach, but their mistake was soon patent. A teacher is one who is able to present what he knows, and has learned of God. No one can teach others beyond what he has learned himself, however much he may attempt it. Some perhaps say to me, You skipped such-and-such a verse without making any comment upon it. I answer, Yes, I did so purposely, because I am not in it.
Ques. What is a pastor?
JBS A pastor is one whose care for the sheep is seen especially in his being able to enter into their state - he understands it. With his gift, the Lord gives him divine insight, and he knows, like a good physician, what you need and what will do you good.
Ques If you felt the need of pastors would you pray for them?
JBS Certainly I would.
FER We must keep in mind that gift is not local, there is no such idea in Scripture as a person with a certain gift, confining it to a certain local assembly; a gift is not simply a channel or pipe, but the man is characterised by his gift.
JBS It has been often said where a company is prospering there is more gift in that place.
Rem Has it not been the other way, sometimes, that where there has been little or no gift, the company has gone on well?
JBS Wherever there is gift there must be subjection [p. 278] to the Lord in the exercise of it. If it assumes the form of ministerialism, it will lead to radicalism.
WH Is it open to a man to get the gift of an evangelist?
JBS I think so. I have heard of a good many young men who go out preaching, but they are not known as praying in the assembly; that is what I should call a very bad beginning, because you never begin right, unless you begin with God. I think myself as to gift that a great lack is, one is not sensible of having received it at a definite moment.
Ques How is the evangelist known?
FER I think you may recognise the evangelist. Scripture presents Philip and Stephen as two distinct servants of the Lord. There is a great contrast between the two. Philip was the evangelist, though Stephen was equally full of the Spirit, but you do not see him as the evangelist; Philip is the bearer of the glad tidings to the eunuch.
THR My idea of an evangelist is that he is a man who is in touch with souls. There are those brought into contact with him who cannot help feeling, That man cares for my soul.
FER In Isaiah 52: 7 you get the idea of the evangelist presented, “How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace”. And the next chapter opens with, “Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the Lord revealed?”
THR What you bring from Christ must be glad tidings. One great thing to see is that God has a Man in His presence who is to His eternal satisfaction, and God is working from that Man.
FER The gift connects itself very intimately with the recipient. Of course the truth is the truth, but undoubtedly it connects itself with the person who presents it. I do not think you could make the [p. 279] evangelist out of Stephen; I think the work of evangelists is much needed among ourselves.
THR I think Paul’s word to Timothy in chapter 4 of the second epistle is very striking. It pictures a day when everything was going to ruin; but he gets this word, “Do the work of an evangelist”. He has this special thing to go on with despite the state of things.
FER I think we have to guard against a mere formal preaching of the gospel every Sunday evening at our rooms.
Rem But we have a notice board up to that effect at nearly every room.
FER Yes, it is so; but I question the rightness of it, for you may be thus making the assembly responsible for the preaching, which is wrong, because gospel preaching is an individual responsibility. I should not object so much to the notice board, if the preacher put his name to it; because my idea is to get the preaching on its proper responsibility. I am sure it is much better where there is an interest awakened in the hearts of the saints in the gospel preaching, and there is real prayer about it, than to be trusting in a notice board.
EC It is too often the case that there is an attempt to sustain a gospel preaching where there is no gift whatever for it.
G I know a place where there is a little meeting and no gift, where the saints give themselves to prayer for the gospel; and if the Lord is pleased to send a servant at any time, they then seek to get the people in to hear.
That is no doubt the happier thing.