Perfect in Thy work divine!" (Hymn 206)

AN ETERNAL ATMOSPHERE

Zephaniah 3: 16,17; Revelation 21: 9-14; 1 Corinthians 13: 8-10

P.M. I thought these passages might help us to get an impression of the atmosphere that will mark eternity, a scene in which God will rest in His love. It must be that the love of God will pervade eternity, not only for man's blessing but for God's pleasure. Everything will be in keeping with it, His righteousness having involved that the whole moral issue should be resolved and met forever, and in the setting in which we are reading, never to arise again. From one point of view it never will arise again, He "shall appear ... the second time without sin for salvation" (Heb. 9: 28). It has been met and met entirely, and the death and blood of Jesus have provided the basis for an eternal scene in which man will be for God's pleasure and evil will never enter.

While in Revelation it is not exactly the eternal setting of which we have read, there is the reference to what the city has, "having the glory of God". We might enquire as to what is involved in that, and perhaps how it is to work out in our local settings, for the atmosphere of eternity is to be working in the local assembly. Now, in the interval Mr Wallace told me that the Lord's Day readings are not for beating out the doctrine but for mutual enquiry and atmosphere. Is that right?

W.W. I did not expect to be quoted, but I thought the Lord's Day readings were a bit different, with more of a family atmosphere. I suppose they begin with Christ, God has found His rest in Christ and He would have us to share that rest.

P.M. I thought we might get some touch of that,

"Object of eternal pleasure,

Object of God's pleasure, and the Object of the pleasure of every heart throughout eternity. Every heart will be centred upon Christ. All has hinged upon that blessed Man. Is that not involved in this reference, "he will rest in his love"? The relationship which the Lord Jesus entered into will never pass away. Divine Persons will appreciate that relationship eternally and God will rest in all that Jesus is, and He will rest in His love as formed in the hearts of those that are before Him.

W.W. David's exercise in Psalm 132 would bear on this. He was thinking of God's pleasure, "Until I find out a place for Jehovah, habitations for the Mighty One of Jacob..." "Arise, Jehovah, into thy rest, thou and the ark of thy strength. Let thy priests be clothed with righteousness, and let thy saints shout for joy." (vv 5,8,9).

P.M. That is affecting because that was in the heart of a young man. Who gave him the light of it? Those of us who are younger could well be stimulated in our affections by what God is looking for. "Thou shalt bring them in", Moses says, "and plant them in the mountain of thine inheritance" (Exodus 15: 17). Think of what God's longings were. It has gone right through, Moses carried it, David carried it, now it has come down to our day.

R.J.C. He says, "Behold, we heard of it at Ephratah, we found it in the fields of the wood" (v 6). Somebody must have been speaking out it. Do you think it would help us if we speak about that? It may arouse interest and exercise with others.

P.M. They were really speaking about Christ, the One in whom God has found His rest. He would no doubt have had some impression of the ark in its place with the staves drawn out. We are familiar in our conversation with the ark proceeding through the wilderness being borne by the Levites - how important that is - but let us also get a sense of the ark in its place with the staves drawn out. David says, 'I will commit myself to that'.

R.T. Does the expression, "he will rest in his love" imply that all the work has been done?

P.M. It must be that the work has been done by Christ, for the moral issue had to be resolved if God was to rest in His love. Then the work of the Spirit too, initially, in our individual exercises shedding abroad the love of God in our hearts, and forming collectively what will display the love of God as formed substantially in a creature vessel. God will rest in that.

J.W. In Ephesians we have, "Jesus Christ himself being the corner-stone, in whom all the building fitted together increases to a holy temple in the Lord; in whom ye also are built together for a habitation of God in the Spirit" (chạp 2: 21,22). Do you think that is the sphere where God can find His rest, and we can enjoy that rest?

P.M. And all taking character from Christ - "Jesus Christ himself", how wonderful that expression is! It could have been, 'Jesus Christ the cornerstone', but "Jesus Christ himself". Does it not give a sense of what He is personally that gives character to all that is for God's pleasure?

D.T.P. I was thinking how long God has waited for this. Of Israel as a nation He says "Let my son go, that he may serve me" (Exod 4: 23); God claims him, but how long He has to wait before there is response. Here things are different, are they not "he will rejoice over thee with joy"? There is a sense of settled relationships and a height reached; then things go on to joy and rest.

P.M. That is very affecting, "he will rejoice over thee with joy". Think of the blessed God rejoicing over thee, the triumph of His ways. Someone referred to it here this morning, God's ways serving His purpose - the triumph of all His ways that have served His purpose in order that God might have the answer, and He will joy in it. It is not just that He secured something equal to what He has purposed, but He has secured something that affects Him because it is equal to what He purposed. It is such that it rejoices the heart of God.

P.B. In Numbers 10 it says, "Return, Jehovah, unto the myriads of the thousands of Israel" (v 36).

P.M. Wonderful, is it not, "the myriads of the thousands of Israel"? Did we not have some sense this morning that we were in the presence of the heavenly hosts? and you think of the fulness of what is ascending to God, the myriads of those that love Him.

C.K.R. Open up a bit what the term 'atmosphere' conveys to you.

P.M. I think it suggests the feelings of the heart of God. There is what God has secured, glorious, great, wondrous, but I think the atmosphere brings out the feelings of the heart of God.

C.K.R. In one sense, is He the Creator of the atmosphere in which He dwells?

P.M. He must be so, and Christ giving character to it. Do you get a reference to it in 1 Corinthians 15, ''that God may be all in all" (v 28)? God puts His own impression upon all that is proceeding for His own pleasure.

C.K.R. Often atmosphere is difficult to describe but it is very often felt.

P.M. And it is essential that there should be an atmosphere in our local companies that reflects the atmosphere of eternity. There we shall be safe. There is safety here, the enemy has been dealt with, ''thou shalt not see evil any more"; there are conditions, you might say eternal life conditions, if we could speak of it in relation to the present day.

D.T.P. That is what has been said as to eternal life, is it not - an out of the world heavenly condition of things - and this is what is expressed as 'atmosphere', because you are taken away from what is here, and brought into the circumstances where Christ is. There things expand, do they not?

P.M. And He the centre of the mediatorial system, giving character to all that is proceeding Godward, and giving expression to all that is flowing from the heart of God. That love is active and will be eternally. We often speak of the love of God that has been active in time and will rest in eternity, but it is not that God's love will rest, it is God who will rest in His love. His love will flow throughout eternity. Not in operating to secure an answer as He does in time, but enjoying the answer that has been secured.

R.J.C. It does not refer to His attributes, does it? He finally secures what is according to His own nature. Atmosphere would enter into that, a sense that God is complacent now in all that He has secured, His love flowing.

P.M. That is helpful. His attributes have been manifested because He has operated in conditions that were not conducive to His holy presence, but He has secured out of such conditions an answer that will for ever be in keeping with His heart.

A.B. I wondered if what God has secured in His purpose and counsels is wonderful. In a sense God has secured everything, has He not? The working out of it in His love and His grace would affect us.

P.M. There is not one thing that He purposed that He has not secured; He has established it all, His purpose involving that He might head up everything in Christ. I think it is good for us when we are younger to get a sense of what the purpose of God is. We often think it is that I shall receive sonship, but the purpose of God does not centre in me, it centres in Christ. He has headed up all things in the Christ. It is wonderful to take account of it. It involved the way in which His love has gone, the depths to which it has gone in the death of Christ, and the fulness of that love now made known in order that God should have an answer in which that love will flow. I would like to get a touch of that, that the love will not be historical, if we could speak of what is historical in eternity, but it will flow throughout eternity. God will be towards His people, "he will rest in his love", and "he will exult over thee with singing".

G.A.B. In 1 Corinthians 13 faith and hope are referred to, which I suppose would enter into God's ways. These are active things, but love is that in which God can rest. It is the greater of these three, is it not?

P.M. Yes: love involves complacency, 'Where there was distance, now there is complacency'. It is wonderful not only to have the doctrine of it, but to get the experience of it that His love will flow throughout eternity in a complacent atmosphere.

G.A.B. It seems as though in that sense the time of activity is over and God is able to rest in His love because everything has been done that can be done. Nothing has been left undone and there is nothing else but pure enjoyment now.

P.M. There will be no work, but as an old brother said where we were local when I was a boy, there will be restful activity and active rest. It is not just that we will as it were sit doing nothing, but we shall be active in the appreciation of all that God is.

M.C. "Sons loved and loving". It is an atmosphere which the world with all its hatred and other things would spoil what is for God but God has in mind that nothing of these things will intrude or take away.

P.M. That is very fine. It is not only that God will be the source of love, as indeed He must be, but He will have an answer in sons that love. Love will pervade eternity. We are in conditions at the moment where righteousness and holiness are often before us, and need to be before us because we are in a world of unholiness and unrighteousness, but in that scene it will be love.

D.T.P. To quote another hymn, "The more we learn Thy love, we love thee more!": that is very true, is it not? This is the time when we are learning more of that love and it should result in atmosphere when there is something yielded in which God has infinite pleasure.

P.M. Do we not see the example of it even in our natural relationships? As a son loves his father, he begins to move as the father moves, he begins to appreciate what the father appreciates. Is that not how it works in relation to divine things that the more we are conscious of being loved by the Father, our affections are drawn out towards Him and we are able to move in something of the spirit that marks the eternal day.

We might move on to Revelation. In the eternal setting, which we did not read, the emphasis is on what God will do, but in the setting that we have read, the emphasis is more on what the city is. I wondered if we could get a touch as to this reference, "having the glory of God".

R.J.C. Does it suggest that the assembly has the capacity to have the glory of God invested in it? I think it has been said that it is not a reflected glory, it is a refracted glory - that the assembly absorbs divine glory and radiates it.

P.M. It must therefore bring out something of the wonderful service of the Holy Spirit. The Lord Jesus has found all that He looked for in the bride, but all that God has looked for He sees expressed in a city that is in keeping with Himself. It is not that she has the glory of Deity. The glory of God here would not be the glory of Deity, that could never be.

A.B. Is it significant that in the gospel John does not give us the bride? The Baptist says in chapter 3, as we know, "He that has the bride is the bridegroom; but the friend of the bridegroom...", but he brings it in here. Could you say why that is?

P.M. I suppose it awaited His death and resurrection and the incoming of the Spirit before the full light of the bride could be seen. But here this is shown to John: the book does not stop at the side of judgment, but it goes right on to show John what God will secure for Himself in a coming day.

R.T. Is the substantiality of the bride emphasised in those verses in the various graces that belong to her that are suited to eternal conditions? "Come here, I will shew thee...". It is already there, precious fruit of God's divine ways in the Spirit's work, but then she had certain features that are suited not to this earth but to eternal conditions for they shine on to the earth.

P.M. I think what you say as to what is substantial is helpful because what John sees could be described. He gets a view of the city that he could describe, "I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife". Then he says, he "shewed me the holy city, Jerusalem, coming down out the heaven from God".

D.T.P. There is something fine, too, in the fact that John could identify what he saw. That seems to be what he writes. He sees all these wonderful things, but he is able to identify the glory that this vessel has and its source. Is that because it has been in those conditions and is coming down?

P.M. Coming from God Himself. It has always been there in the purpose of God, but now it is about to come into display, and it has the glory of God. Then there is her shining. I wondered if the glory of God might have some reference to our being partakers of the divine nature, what is currently formed in the saints through the Spirit, involving affections that will mark eternity. It has the glory of God, it is formative, is it not?

P.B. Does "her shining" mean that it is in perfect keeping with the glory of God?

P.M. There will be no disparity. Does it not relate to what is mediatorial in the divine system, in which the assembly will take up her part. She will take up her part mediatorially.

R.T. Will the Spirit have a relationship with the assembly that will be greater or deeper than with any other families? Would that be suggested here in "having the glory of God"?

P.M. Yes, she is distinctive in the fact that the Spirit will be indwelling the assembly. The Spirit will rest upon other families, but the assembly will be indwelt by the Holy Spirit. Is that so?

R.T. It speaks of nations and others who will bring their glory to it, showing that there is a glory that belongs to the assembly that is fuller than what there is in other families. You may say that the whole mediatorial system is enhanced in the place that the assembly has in the link with the Spirit in Christ.

P.M. I think it is good that we should get a sense of that because if we are not careful, our impression of the assembly may be limited to what we touch in the public breakdown; but the assembly is so great, she will take up her part in the mediatorial system and the nations will walk by its light. Think of the fulness of what will shine out from the assembly and, as you say, the nations will bring their glory to it. She will be forever united to Christ as the heavenly Man, and indwelt by the Holy Spirit. How near to divine Persons this city will be!

W.W. In Ephesians 1 it is not the city. Does this bring out the distinctiveness of the assembly - "and gave him to be head over all things to the assembly, which is his body, the fulness of him who fills all in all" (v 22,23)? I was thinking of what was said as to the other families. The assembly is distinct amongst the families, first of all the families the only family with the indwelling Spirit. I think it has been suggested that Christ will confer with the assembly in His administration, so near she is to Him, and she is His fulness, speaking reverently, as though He were not complete without her.

P.M. Would that we had a greater sense of that. The city here involves administration, does it not? The perfect administration of Christ will be in relation to the city. Does not "the fulness of him" relate to expression? Did not F.E.R. help us that the fulness in Christianity involves the expression of the substance, that she is really the expression, and will be throughout the millennial day, of all that Christ is in His manhood.

W.W. Mr Taylor said the fulness is not as great as the thing itself. We must preserve Christ's distinctiveness personally, but the assembly is such a wonderful vessel that, though never more than creature, yet she is in the nearest relationship to deity that could be.

P.M. And she will remain united to the heavenly Man. I believe that marks her out also in her distinctiveness, that she is united to Christ where He is.

P.W. Would you say something more about the distinction you drew between the glory of deity and the glory of God, and perhaps open up the glory of God a bit more in relation to the Trinity. Mr R Taylor made a reference to the Spirit, the glory of the Spirit indwelling the assembly, but I would like more help about the distinction between the deity and God and also perhaps a reference to the other persons of the Godhead.

P.M. I do not know if I could say much in answer to your question, but the glory of deity must belong alone to divine Persons. It could never belong to or be placed upon creature. "My glory I will not give to another" (Isa 42: 8), it belongs to God alone, but I think this reference, "having the glory of God" is very closely related to the nature of God, God's love, that has been formed in the hearts of those that form this vessel and will come into expression. In one sense, persons in the millennial day will look at the city and say, 'That is what God's shining is like'. Wonderful thing! It will not be God Himself; it is, "her shining", but persons will get an impression that that is what the shining of God is like.

P.W. Should there not be something of that evident today in the assembly, not in that fulness, but there should be an expression of it.

P.M. I think it shines today morally in the assembly. The simple person coming in at Corinth would say, "God is among you of a truth"; there was the witness that the presence of God was there.

G.A.B. The assembly has been in the presence of God, has it not? It says, it comes "down out of the heaven from God". She could hardly be there without the glory of God being absorbed in some sense, taken on. Would you have an illustration of it in Moses' face shining through His talking with him. It is taken on and displayed.

P.M. It is taken on. That vessel has never belonged to the earth; it has always been heavenly, and has been in the presence of God Himself. She bears no other feature. We used to be taught that the assembly is heavenly in origin, character and destiny. Through wondrous grace we belong to that vessel and the dignity of that should affect us in our walk individually and collectively. You come into a company like this. What marks it? It is the heavenly atmosphere: the assembly is heavenly.

C.K.R. Is it right to think that the atmosphere of eternity will in some sense be displayed in the millennium?

P.M. You had better open that up for us.

C.K.R. I would like to get the full bearing of it. It is "having the glory of God". Verse 2 indicates what is eternal, "prepared as a bride adorned for her husband" after a thousand years, but still there is freshness there.

P.M. I am sure the witness of the eternal atmosphere will be present in the millennium, and it will be known in a peculiar way by those that are in the city. When the saints are translated, we shall immediately be in eternal conditions. We shall not be part of what is proceeding on the earth; we shall remain heavenly, and what will sustain that city will be completely apart from what marks this scene and all that will proceed in it, but the city will shed its own atmosphere upon that scene.

C.K.R. It would also enhance the appearing, would it not? Some sense of the greatness of the rapture having taken place and the saints taking on glorified conditions lying behind the Lord coming out and declaring His rights publicly.

P.M. Yes and her relations with Him as the Lamb's wife - a wonderful thing that will be known and enjoyed throughout the millennial day, she will remain as the Lamb's wife. She will hold herself for Him and for the expression of Himself, but she will never cease to have the glory of God.

R.T. Is God reflected in the shining - "having the glory of God", and it says, "Her shining was like a most precious stone"?

P.M. "Her shining", what more would you say about it?

R.T. We have later on, "And the city has no need of the sun nor the moon, that they should shine for it"; "having the glory of God" gives character to this kind of shining. There is something superior to anything that has been seen before, superior to the old creation, you may say. There is what is shining out from this vessel that is from the glory of God really, is it not?

P.M. There will be perfect harmony between what she has and what shines forth.

M.C. I was thinking of what we have been taught, the response being equal to the revelation, and wondering how it would bear on this, the full outshining of God involving formation in love and response being equal to what divine Persons themselves would secure.

P.M. That is something for us to ponder, the response equal to the revelation. In one sense that must be perfectly so in Jesus, the revelation is in Him and the response is in Him, but I think this reference comes very close to that.

D.M. Could you say something as to the Lamb's wife. It is not the Lord's wife nor the wife of Christ, it is the Lamb's wife. Is there some reference to the suffering through which He has gone?

P.M. It is an affecting reference, the Lamb's wife. All has been secured on the basis of His suffering, but there is a vessel in which there has been formation through suffering. How much suffering there is today, not only among ourselves but with others who will comprise this vessel: think of persons who suffered behind the Iron Curtain, persons who suffer in China and other countries. They are faithful to the light that they have. That will all enter into some measure of formation in this city.

I wondered if in Corinthians we might get a touch as to the greatness of that love that works out through the local company. As was said, finally there are features that will be done away, they will not be needed any longer, but love remains.

D.McG. Is the significance of Paul's ministry to Titus that in such a company in its behaviour, he should speak of "awaiting the blessed hope and appearing of the glory", not 'of our Saviour', but "of our great God and Saviour Jesus Christ" (Titus 2: 13)? I think it is an enticement and a great encouragement to think that despite all that we might be marked by and have to work out in a spirit of self-judgment in order to eat and drink worthily, eternity is opened to us in that way.

P.M. We are going through a scene in which we feel the departure and the public breakdown. We are waiting for the appearing of our great God and Saviour Jesus Christ. How great He is! Oh, that His greatness might fill my soul increasingly and not only objectively, but in view of having a full claim over our affections. He has moved towards us in His affections in order that He might secure ours.

D.McG. "Perpetual freshness marks th'eternal day".

P.M. Yes. There is what will be done away. We concentrate a good deal on it and it has its place and its importance, and it needs to be filled out, taken up and carried out soberly while we are here, but it is not eternal; but love will remain.

G.A.B. Does “that which is perfect" involve the body of glory? You cannot but feel the limitations of the present time. We have an hour or thereabouts on Lord's Day morning of something that takes us out of this scene, but then we have to stop. We cannot go on because of the condition in which we are, but "when that which is perfect has come", we will have bodies which will be equal to the environment into which we have been brought.

P.M. And we will have bodies like unto His own body of glory. He will give character to it all, even the bodies of the saints will take character from His. How wonderful that is. You can see that God must head up everything in Christ. The whole of the eternal day will reflect in every detail the glory of that blessed Man.

P.B. "Love never fails".

P.M. I wonder if I believe that. Things do arise in our gatherings, and we are conscious of them. Let us lay hold of it that love never fails. How has God moved towards us? He has moved in love. Where would we be if it was not for His love? "Because of his great love wherewith he loved us" (Ephesians 2: 4) - that is to be seen in expression, in the local company. It is not just that things are put right in the spirit of love when they go wrong but "love never fails ", things do not go wrong. Things and persons are maintained in affection for Christ. I believe - I feel the need of it for myself - that if this atmosphere marked us more, often the disturbances that arise would soon be resolved because love never fails.

D.McG. The one to whom this revelation was made was one who could speak of himself as "the disciple whom Jesus loved", and at one point in his history he is leaning on the bosom of Jesus. I wonder if that would help us in the resolving of these things you are speaking about. It is to him that the word is "Come here", and immediately, as if he were ready, having had these experiences when Jesus was here.

P.M. He lived in the enjoyment of the love of Jesus, therefore the Lord could say of him finally, "If I will that he abide until I come" (John 21:22). There was that which was stable in John that was going through to the end because he was drawing on the love of Jesus.

"The love of Jesus, what it is,

None but His loved ones know." (Hymn 279)

That is to pervade the local company.

J.W. Love is the fruit of the Spirit. It is spiritual love, it is not natural love, is it?

P.M. That is important. It is not just a social company that we have been brought to. If it was a social company on man's level, it would soon end in corruption, but this is really the reflection of the love of God working in the local company so that everyone is in their place, everyone is happy, everyone is centred on Christ. I think you see something of it in Bethany. Death had come in, that first order of natural affection had been broken in upon and removed, but there were conditions in which love was known and Christ was the Centre.

D.M. The last verse of that hymn 456, "Thy willing people, formed in love from which no power shall sever" - I wondered if that fitted in with what you were saying at the moment.

P.M. That really sums up what we have been working at, that God will have a people eternally that have been formed in love. But let us not wait till the eternal day, let us enjoy the atmosphere of it now increasingly.

 

KIRKCALDY

12 June 1994

 

Key to initials

(local unless indicated)

G.A.B. G.A.Brown, Edinburgh; A.B. A.Buchan; P.B. P.Buchan; R.J.C. R.J.Campbell, Glasgow; M.C. M.Cowan; D.McG. D.McGregor, Lochgelly; P.M. P.Martin, Colchester; D.M. D.Matthews; D.T.P. D.T.Pye; C.K.R. C.K.Robinson, Glasgow; R.T. R.Taylor; W.W. W.Wallace; P.W. P.White; J.W. J.Wilson