LOVE TO ALL THE SAINTS
LOVE TO ALL THE SAINTS
JT What came to my mind in regard to the subject before us is the fact that the Colossians had love. It says, “the love which ye have towards all the saints”. That is in a certain sense the key to this epistle. Both this company and that at Ephesus had love.
GN That would be the atmosphere of the christian circle — that is what you get in Colossians?
JT Yes, that is in the company who had love as a common thing; as the Lord said, “have love amongst yourselves”. John 13:35 I have been thinking lately a little about love. The Lord speaking in Spirit as Wisdom in Proverbs, says. “… that I may cause those that love me to inherit substance”. Proverbs 8:21 The Lord here in all His movements was marked by wisdom. Those that were drawn to Him would see not only beauty — His personal beauty, but that wisdom was there, and love begotten by wisdom. He ensures a condition of things that is wholly in accord with the mind of God. Wisdom having been with God at the outset in everything that was done, is now with Him in what He is doing. The Lord says, “My Father worketh hitherto and I work”. John 5:17 It was there in Christ from the outset, and those who were about Him loved Him in that way, so that the love that is amongst us is or should be marked by wisdom; in Colosse the fact that they had love afforded the Spirit of God the opportunity to bring in certain things in regard to Christ as Head. The Spirit had liberty to bring in Christ in a personal way, because love appreciates the personal touch. Moses from the outset was a remarkable man personally, but his personality would be [p. 90] largely hidden behind his officialism, he was an official as representing God. But at the end of the wilderness his personal touch is seen in a particular way. God says, ‘Now you have got to go up and die’. ‘Well’, he says, ‘put a man over the people which may lead them, that they may not be like sheep which have no shepherd’. He loved the people and God says ‘there is Joshua, he is a man who has got the Spirit’. The going in is a spiritual matter, and you have got to change from Moses to Joshua: He is not going to lead them in, but a man is going to lead them in who has the Spirit. It is a spiritual thing, and so Moses writes all these words, that is the whole book of Deuteronomy, thirty — four chapters, all to the end that, although he is not going to take them in himself, they should go in suitably. It is not here the official, it is the man himself, because of the affection which he shows for the people, and his thought is that they should go in suitably, that there should be no discrepancy between them and the land which God had given them, so that the personal touch comes out at the end. It corresponds in my mind with John 14, in which the Lord prepares a place, a new order of things.
GN Do you mean that the children of Israel journeyed with Moses by the instructions he gave them, but the crossing of the Jordan was a matter of affection?
JT Yes. The fact that the Colossians had love among themselves, induces the Spirit of God to bring before them certain features which were yet lacking, because we may have love and yet certain features be lacking.
Ques Would authority be set forth at the Red Sea?
JT Yes. It is the rod of Moses there.
[p. 91] Ques Would authority be connected with light and what is personal with love?
JT Yes. It is love that makes way for headship.
Rem So that Romans would be light, while Colossians would be love.
JF Why do you connect Colossians with this point in the history of the children of Israel?
JT Colossians is the place where the saints are entering the land, and so corresponds to Deuteronomy. Deuteronomy is as far as Moses can take them, he is practically head, but he is not Joshua. There is that which you need as preliminary education on the other side of Jordan. It is not a question of one’s place in relation to the tabernacle. It is no question now of the public order of Corinthians, but how you are going to be in the new order of things where Christ is. One may behave fairly well in the light of Corinthians, but when you come to Joshua — to Colossians, it puts you to the test. How are you going to do in an order of things where everything is governed by divine wisdom, wisdom being the handmaid of love? He says here, “As therefore ye have received the Christ, Jesus the Lord, walk in him”. I think it is very essential that we have love among ourselves, and that we have love towards all the saints. It is not simply that I love those that are local, but all the saints.
CP It is a vital thing in the assembly. What our attention is being called to is vital to us. It is not knowledge.
JT There is one great danger, and that is localism. You may have order, and the Lord may be adding, and we begin to think of ourselves in relation to what we have locally. The Ephraimites seriously threatened Gideon, that is they were local, Gideon was general, he says, “Is not the gleaning of the grapes of Ephraim better than the vintage of Abiezer?” Judges 8:2. He was not occupied with what he had.
[p. 92] Rem So that God would lead us on to what is universal.
JT “The love”, it says here, “which ye have towards all the saints”. If any came there, whether they came from Jerusalem or Thessalonica or Corinth, they would all find the same thing. There would be no preference or favour to the one from Jerusalem. They would think equally as well of the Thessalonian, because they had the thing there that was general or universal.
Rem I suppose the danger of being local is that there may be rivalry as between localities.
JT A real danger, and one has seen it. This love among ourselves towards all the saints, I think, is the safeguard to that.
GN If we are taken up with what is local we might stop short of what is the purpose of God.
JT I think we stop growth. Growth is in relation to the whole. The Lord is Head of the body, now if I am local unduly I stop that as far as I am concerned, because the nourishment comes from the head and the body grows proportionately. You would not like to see the right hand longer than the left.
Rem From whom the whole body is fitly joined together.
AF Headship is universal. We ought to be on the line of headship.
JT Yes. This instruction is very important because [p. 93] the two — and — a — half tribes had already decided that they would not go over. They had not love among themselves. In fact what they thought about was their cattle. Love among yourselves does not include cattle.
Ques Do not you think that is a real danger at the present time?
JT Certainly. The king of Sodom says to Abraham, you take the goods and I will take the persons. It is the persons you want, love for persons.
The two — and — a — half tribes had made up their minds, they would be content without persons.
Rem They would be earth dwellers.
JT Yes. Where he mentions the love on account of the hope which is laid up for you in the heavens, that is the love that the saints have. The love of God is shed abroad in my heart by the Spirit, that is the wilderness side of Jordan, because the Holy Spirit came in in the wilderness. If he begets love, as He does, shedding the love of God abroad in my heart, it is in relation to the hope, and the hope is for all the saints. When I think of the hope I do not think of local assemblies at all. He does not present assemblies to Himself. Assemblies are provisional. They are like gardens. “My beloved is gone down into his garden ... to feed in the gardens”, Song of Songs 6:2. He has got his garden; it is general — but then there are gardens. Gardens may be used to illustrate assemblies — the provisional thing, but that is not connected with the heavenly hope.
CP In Numbers God speaks of the people as gardens by the river’s side.
JT That is it. He does not present assemblies to Himself. He presents the assembly to Himself because that is the end of the thing, the primary thought.
CP Gardens are on the wilderness side of Jordan.
JT That would be like Corinthians. Corinthians is assemblies and the Lord comes to them to feed in His gardens. There are no assemblies in the heavens. There is one assembly there.
GN What is meant by changing over to Joshua? Is Joshua a type of the Spirit?
JT He is rather a type of Christ in a spiritual way. It is what the Lord is as having passed out of this world altogether. What He is as risen and gone on high is a spiritual thing. He comes in in spite of closed doors. The authority of the Lord requires that there is one door in the room. A man shall [p. 94] meet you with a pitcher of water. That is his interest in you. Follow him and enter where he goes. There is only one entrance, and the clock has to do with that — “when the hour was come”. Luke 22:14 The time of day has to do with that and all public things, but the Joshua side, the spiritual side is “the doors were shut” John 20:19 not ‘door’, but “doors”. The Lord comes in, in spite of closed doors. That is to every saint, as it were, there is a door.
CP You are not speaking of Joshua as the one who leads them over, but what is true of them on the other side. Is he a type of Christ as Captain of our salvation?
JT He is more. In leading many sons to glory, He is the Leader of our salvation.
Rem So that Moses would represent lordship, while Joshua would represent headship.
AS Was the apostle’s distress for the Colossians personal or official?
JT I think it is apostolic there. His thought was to present every man perfect in Christ. It is like Moses in Deuteronomy. He would present every Israelite, as it were, perfect. I was saying in reference to the two — and — a — half tribes that they had made up their minds that they were just going so far. It is not that they did not have love. They had it as the others, but there are many of the Lord’s people who make up their minds that they will go so far and no further. Earthly possessions detain them. “We have much cattle”, Deuteronomy 3:19 they say. They are detained by the providences of God, in fact by what they should have offered in sacrifice.
GN When you come to the side of Christ as head, it is love that answers to that, you love the Lord.
JT The woman in Luke 7 anoints His feet. She saw that those feet had carried Him into the world, and she does not mean to detain Him in the world. After the resurrection they held Him by the feet but [p. 95] that was unintelligent. Mary of Bethany anointed His feet. It meant that she saw that He was going out of the world. “Against the day of my burying hath she kept this”. John 12:7 And so Mary Magdalene in chapter 20 — she wanted Him, and He pointed out to her, ‘if you are to have me, you must be in correspondence with me’. So He says, “Touch me not”. John 20:17 So that love would delight to answer to that.
JT Quite. I do think that this determination today to go to a certain point and not go beyond it, is a very serious one. You maintain distinctions, whereas over Jordan there is no distinction. It is “in Christ Jesus”.
Rem I suppose the danger of these things is that they are all legitimate.
JT Well, you can go on with them with a good conscience. Here were two — and — a — half tribes with spiritual advantages and yet they made up their minds not to go any further. They would go over to fight, but only for a short time. They wanted an altar set up, but it was not for sacrifices. It is like a brother saying, ‘I have got property and a large family. I want to live on my property and in my family, but I want to maintain my place among the saints, I can go in at any time and take part with you. But I am not at home there, my home is elsewhere’. It was not a right thought for them to set up an altar. It was just to notify the ten tribes that they had a right to the land, but they were not taking it up.
GN Lordship is connected with the wilderness, and headship with the land.
JT Moses went as near headship as he could, because it is not the official Moses. “These are the words which Moses spoke” Deuteronomy 1:1; it is not ‘Thus saith the Lord’, but “These are the words which Moses spoke”; it is his own personal desire for the people, and that desire was according to the Lord, he loved the [p. 96] people.
FW Is it only earthly things that would detain one from going over?
JT I think that it would be that generally. I do not think that to emphasise the local thought too much would rob us of the general thought. It is not so many assemblies in the heavens. It is one assembly in the heavens. He comes into His garden — that is the whole assembly on earth. But He feeds in His gardens; he gets variety — that is He is gathering lilies.
Ques Is it occupation with the person: “as ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord”?
JT He begins with the state in you. It is not here, what is presented to you in the way of light. It is what you have received. That is, he begins with the subjective thing. You have received the Christ, Jesus the Lord. It is not the Lord Jesus Christ; that would be Romans, “put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ”. Romans 13:14 That is the kind of garb in which you appear according to Romans, but here you have received the Christ, Jesus the Lord. That is, you have made a start, a very good start, and it is for everyone to see that you have made such a start.
Ques What did you say ‘The Christ’ set forth?
JT The One who does everything for God.
GMcK I suppose our exercises should be that the local is governed by the general.
JT You are in a way as interested in the saints in New Zealand, as in Glasgow, although you are responsible there. You keep it in relation to the one garden.
GMcK A common end in view.
GN So the truth of headship would preserve us from being local. He is Head of the assembly. We all come under the same headship.
AF Do you make a distinction between coming [p. 97] together in assemblies — in Corinthians — and one taking his place in the assembly?
JT “In the midst of the assembly will I sing thy praises” Hebrews 2:12 — I think that is the general idea, because Hebrews contemplates the whole — “whose house are we”. Hebrews 3:6 Although he is writing to the christians in Judaea it is “we”. This house includes all christians. It is the general idea in Hebrews throughout. The breaking of bread begins in New Zealand or Australia, thinking of the order of the day. It goes on the whole day till perhaps eight o’clock; you will pardon my simple allusion. You know the Lord comes into His garden, the whole assembly is before Him if He comes in. He comes in, in relation to the whole, but then He has His gardens. He has His special gardens in which He feeds. It is most interesting that the breaking of bread runs on to eight o’clock in the evening or may be longer as the sun goes round.
CP What about the gathering of the lilies?
JT That is what the saints are. Gathering lilies is a beautiful thought. He feeds among them, and then it says He gathers them. He has His own thoughts about you. He has got His own thoughts and He will bring you to these thoughts. He is gathering the lilies; He is not gathering up the worthless of the earth but what is valuable in His eyes. He says “Consider the lilies how they grow: they toil not, they spin not; and yet I say unto you, that Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these”. Luke 12:27 The saint today has got more glory than Solomon. If God so clothe the grass — it is what God does, the Lord is looking for those who are divinely clothed. I think that Colossians is to bring us up to that.
GN Why is circumcision and baptism brought in?
JT All these are to bring us into correspondence. It is His circumcision, There was handwriting, now [p. 98] handwriting stands out against you and that is known and recognised. That could be disposed of by no one but Christ and His death.
Rem I suppose one accepting baptism in the Colossian sense would be able to go on his way rejoicing.
JT The eunuch would love to be in the company of that Man, would he not? “Concerning whom does the prophet say this? of himself or of some other?” Acts 8:34 Philip began at that scripture, and announced unto him — Jesus. He is willing to die with Him and he goes on his way rejoicing. He would be quite a Colossian saint.
Rem That is the point of view here, and the eunuch illustrates it. You get the Spirit in the next chapter.
GN Movement would come in there. It is movement of the affections.
JT It is remarkable about that eunuch. There is an angel, and there is a eunuch and a man comes miraculously and he is taken away miraculously. He is born in spiritual circumstances, in heavenly circumstances, he is really begotten in the heavenlies. “The hope which is laid up for you in the heavens”. Colossians 1:5 He went on his way. He was going to Colosse and he finds his way. You have to find what that way is. Colossians are entering; it is not in the land. You are still on the way and we must take note of that. You are going into the land — God’s land. If you are over Jordan in the conflict, you do not go back to Moab, you go back to Gilgal.
Rem The eunuch was not going to be detained by the plains of Moab.
JT No, he went on his way happily. I believe he got in his soul the thought, ‘I would like to be with that Man, His life is taken from the earth, and I do not want to be in life here’. Your life is hid with Christ in God. The man disappears. We know [p. 99] no more of him. In John 12, at Bethany they acted rightly. There is no word as to the Lord telling them what to do. It is all what they did and the Lord accepts it. The conditions were there in a way — six days before the Passover — there they made Him a supper. Martha serves, Lazarus was one who sat at the table with Him, but Mary anoints His feet. The Lord accepts what they did.
CP The conditions were there — they loved Him.
JT And their conduct was quite in keeping with Bethany, but there is something beyond Bethany. In chapter 20 it is not a locality. I think chapter 20 is the climax to the instruction which began in chapter 13.
WH So that the Supper would be connected with what is local, the assembly would be abstract, it would not be local.
JT The assembly would be connected with John 20; chapter 13 would be the local thing.
Rem You would say that the experience of John 20 would be like Paul in the third heaven. You do not know whether you are in the body or out of it.
JT The Lord said to Mary, “Go to my brethren and say to them, I ascend”, John 20:17 as if He were going at once, and she goes to the brethren, and He gives a heavenly visitation.
GN Where would you put the company in the end of Luke?
JT That would be more the Pentecostal company, the public thing. That is, Luke presents rather the public side. The Spirit comes upon them there, whereas in John He breathes into them.