ADMINISTRATION (10)
ADMINISTRATION (10)
Revelation 21:9 - 27; Revelation 22:1 - 5
JT At our last reading, which was our first in the New Testament on administration, it was remarked that we should consider the subject from the top, so to speak. We read from Ephesians which denotes the highest level of the truth. A like thought enters into our present meeting, the passage in Revelation 21 having been suggested because it is a continuation of the idea on the highest level of the truth. The epistles to the Corinthians and the gospels give us the lower levels of the truth we are considering. This scripture fits in as a continuation of the last meeting. The epistle of James speaks of what comes down from above: “Every good gift and every perfect gift comes down from above, from the Father of lights, with whom is no variation nor shadow of turning”, chapter 1: 17. John the baptist in John’s gospel says, “He who comes from above is above all”, chapter 3:31. And so, too, in Acts 10, the sheet is seen coming down to furnish light as to the mind of God in view of the incoming of the gentiles. There is, therefore, in such passages the suggestion of how foundational truth comes in from the top. The final arrangement comes into evidence as the truth settles down in the sense of foundational truth, and certain features that may seem irregular are regulated.
ANW Has it been rightly said that Paul’s ministry sees the assembly placed in heaven, and John’s ministry brings it out?
JT Paul places it in heaven, so to speak, and John brings it out here where it is to be displayed. John, however, speaks of the ascension prominently in chapter 20 of his gospel in view of the assembly as a vessel for the service of God here and the government of God. The ascension is not brought forward in Matthew; in fact, it is said by the Lord, “And behold,
[p. 448] I am with you all the days, until the completion of the age”, chapter 28: 20, as if He is here all the time. There is need for His vigilance and care in view of the treasure in the vessel and the government of God here below.
CAM Would you say that the reference to one of the seven angels which had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues would show that the moral questions were all settled before John is shown the bride, the Lamb’s wife?
JT There is an intimate connection between the judgment in the last plagues and what is presented here in the holy city in relation to the most positive and blessed features of administration. Therefore, what is said about Babylon, which is the earthly system, would suggest itself to the mind. It shows how that system is dealt with in unmitigated judgment. It seems as if the settlement of things requires that we should see how judgment is meted out to what is spurious. The assembly in this chapter points to the most blessed features of administration as coming down from God out of heaven. The link in that way with judgment is remarkable, and in view of the great stress laid on administrative principles in chapter 21, it is that our minds should be settled as to all that is evil. In this chapter there is that which is capable of settling every moral issue, and in the most positive way. This chapter affords principles more than any as to the subject of administration in the number twelve.
AAT The holy city comes down in contrast to Satan who falls down.
JT Quite so; the devil is cast out of heaven, Revelation 12:9. The Lord says, “I beheld Satan as lightning falling out of heaven”, (Luke 10:18); whereas, what is before us now is the liberty wherewith Christ has set us free, involving sonship, because Jerusalem above is our mother. This implies sonship. She is seen coming down [p. 449] out of heaven from God having all these blessed features of administration.
AR Do you think it requires elevation to see this? John was carried to a high mountain.
JT Just so.
APT Have you something more in mind about the numeral twelve?
JT That is why the chapter was read. If we look at verse 12, we shall see — “having a great and high wall; having twelve gates and at the gates twelve angels, and names inscribed, which are those of the twelve tribes of the sons of Israel. On the east three gates; and on the north three gates; and on the south three gates; and on the west three gates. And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them twelve names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb”, verses 12 - 14. There are other allusions to be made, but these are only to show how the idea of twelve enters into this chapter in a most prominent way.
APT There seem to be nine references to the thought of twelve in this section. Reference is made to twelve gates; twelve angels; twelve tribes of the sons of Israel; twelve foundations; twelve names; twelve apostles of the Lamb, and twelve pearls.
JT So that the numeral twelve stands out prominently, as remarked. And then there is the administrative personnel which we have already alluded to. There are the twelve angels, twelve tribes of the sons of Israel, and the twelve apostles of the Lamb; so that the personnel in the administration is very striking, covering men as well as angels. It is not the children of Israel, but individual personnel, denoting their dignity. I think we have to bear in mind, in thinking of these things, what is current among the nations at the present time, and has been for many years past; that is, the great uncertainty which marks government, and the tendency to disintegration and degeneration. There is constant [p. 450] reduction in quality as seen in the great image in Daniel. The general trend is deterioration from the top to the bottom until we come down to the lowest elements.
JTJr Do you regard this chapter as an extension of Ephesians 1, where the assembly is spoken of as being the fulness? Does the fulness appear here in the city?
JT I think so, because we are dealing with the assembly, which is said to be “the fulness of him who fills all in all”, (Ephesians 1:23).
ANW In that connection would the holy city in verse 2 be on a higher level than in verse 10?
JT The idea of newness is there. “And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea exists no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem”. We are looking on toward the eternal condition; whereas, in verse 9, we come back again to millennial conditions in which this thought of administration is carried out with a view to showing what God can do with men in flesh and blood. It shows what He can do, and then the thought of flesh and blood will disappear, but in spite of what Satan has done and will do. God will show that He can carry on with flesh and blood. He is not obliged to resort to actual resurrection conditions. He can carry out His thoughts in connection with men and women in flesh and blood.
ANW There is no deterioration in the bride. At the end of the thousand years she is as a bride adorned for her husband.
JT Yes; quite so. There is no change, but the outlook is toward eternity; whereas the other side is of very great moral importance. It is the same personnel and qualities, only what is to be dealt with in government is imperfect.
RWS It says, “And they shall bring the glory and the honour of the nations to it”, verse 26. Does that mean that there will be a change in [p. 451] the nations?
JT There will be, but the millennium does not present a perfect condition. I think the intent is that God will show that He can carry on with men and nations in flesh and blood. He can carry out His administrative thoughts in spite of what Satan has done and may do. At the beginning of the chapter the outlook is to eternity. It is what God intends to bring about eternally; whereas in time He has recourse to means which will show what He can do in the one thousand years. There is not a complete breakdown; the instrumentality through which He operates is the assembly in glory, and therefore there is no complete breakdown, although on earth there may be deterioration, as we see typified in Numbers 29, where the bullocks are reduced from thirteen to seven. The perfect idea, in the sense of administration, is retained, only there is a breaking up of certain elements. In spite of this the thoughts of God go through. When the devil makes his final attack, heaven intervenes and that is the end of the matter.
CN In the end of verse 10, it speaks of the holy city, Jerusalem, coming down out of the heaven from God, having the glory of God. Is there anything greater than that?
JT If you compare glory in regard to what is created, there would be nothing greater. God is the God of glory; and He is the Father of glory. So when Scripture speaks of the glory of God, you have perfection in glory.
Question Would love have a great part in this matter, the number twelve being mentioned so frequently?
JT Yes, and this section of the chapter contemplates perfection in the heavenly side, because this is what comes down from above. It is from the Father of lights. All is on the coming-down line, but then it is in relation to earth in the millennium, and the earth would imply that there is some defect. A sinner of one hundred [p. 452] years shall be cut off in the millennium, but from the heavenly side there is no change at all. It passes on into eternity, but the earthly side is adjusted when flesh and blood conditions disappear.
JAP Should this elevated side of things keep us in our care meetings so that there should not be any breakdown in present administration?
JT Well, it is an encouragement that, in one sense, there is not a breakdown. Properly speaking, from Paul’s point of view, there may be, and will be, but still, what is set out in Paul is intact in principle. I am using that phrase in principle because it is important. In principle it goes through. Details do not affect it. They are just details, and God can deal with the details, as He will do in a very peremptory way, for fire will come down from God out of heaven and consume the attackers of the holy city even though they are great enough in number to go up on the breadth of the earth.
RWS That will occur after the millennium, will it not?
JT Quite so; but I mention it to bring out how God deals with such a matter so that there is no continuation of evil. God is not going to permit of that. Fire comes down and consumes them. That is the most severe way of dealing with wickedness. Peter tells us that the new heavens and the new earth will be the outcome of destruction of the present ones by fire. “By reason of which the heavens, being on fire, shall be dissolved, and the elements, burning with heat, shall melt”, (2 Peter 3:12). It is immediately, finally and positively done.
JTJr The fire comes down from heaven. But it is not fire in our scripture. It is the assembly that is seen coming down. Christ came down from heaven, and now the assembly comes down.
JT Just so, and the Spirit, too, came down, sent down, indeed, and has an important place dispensationally. It is a long dispensation. Whilst the millennium [p. 453] will continue for a thousand years, yet the actual judgment will take place very quickly and with finality, too.
DP You were remarking about the reduction in quality of administration amongst the nations, but the bride, the Lamb’s wife, is to retain her freshness throughout the ages.
JT Just so; that is seen, as we have noted already: “And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of the heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband”, verse 2; and then in verse 10; “And he carried me away in the Spirit, and set me on a great and high mountain, and shewed me the holy city, Jerusalem, coming down out of the heaven from God, having the glory of God. Her shining was like a most precious stone, as a crystal-like jasper stone; having a great and high wall”. So there is the same freshness in both verses; the assembly is untouchable in that sense. The first is in relation to eternity, and the second is the provisional government of God here in the millennium. The assembly is seen as intact in both cases. But notice the repeated reference to the number twelve, which is to show, I think, that love is active in administration.
AR There is not much said of what is inside the city, but considerable detail is given about the wall. Its bearing is outward.
JT The prominence given to the wall is a thing to be noted, and it shows that what we are saying is right. The second part of the chapter deals with divine protection, so that there is no possibility of breaking in on what God has in mind. The extent of the walls is a guarantee for that.
RWS The way great nations have broken solemn covenants would stand in sharp contrast to the standards which are being maintained in the assembly.
JT The height of the wall and the breadth of it, and the greatness of it are a guarantee that it is the same [p. 454] thing that goes into eternity; only here it is in the character of the wall to affect our minds as to the security that is connected with the assembly in these circumstances.
CN The foundation is as great as the gates in that respect, would you say? The gates would be the administration, the foundations would be the support.
JT That word ‘foundations’ is noteworthy. There are twelve foundations of the wall. The wall is more in mind than the city because that is where the strength and the defence are needed. There will be nothing like that necessary in eternal conditions.
TNW What would hades’ gates suggest?
JT The power of Satan in what he has organised in power and wisdom. It is what you might call his wisdom, and the gates would denote that it is the best he can do, but his best is not equal to what God has done. That is a present view of the matter. He cannot break through.
WCR Was this seen, in principle, in Ananias and Sapphira being dealt with quickly?
JT Quite so; there was power there and the evil was immediately overcome. Later on, it was not so, but it was so there, and it was Peter who acted. It is the administrative side, I would say.
JTJr It is the masculine side in Peter, but it is feminine here. The bride is feminine, but in the twelve apostles it is what is masculine.
JT Just so; your mind is directed to the book of Proverbs, where there is demand for the woman of worth. This book shows that there is a woman of worth, and that she takes care of her husband’s affairs, and He is known in the gates through her.
TEH In the book of Nehemiah when the wall was being built and finished, Nehemiah brought the princes of Judah down to the wall, as if it needed masculine strength to retain the glory.
[p. 455] JT Just so; and another thing that helps in Nehemiah is that the queen was sitting by. Nehemiah’s position is the active masculine side, but the queen is passive and sitting by the king. Here she is active; the feminine side is seen in all those features of administrative power and wisdom.
SW Is the wall in Nehemiah the same as the wall here?
JT The idea would be the same, but there is no other wall like this, because the reference to it in verse 17 shows that it is one hundred and forty-four cubits. “And he measured its wall, a hundred and forty-four cubits, a man’s measure, that is, the angel’s”.
ANW We are to be reminded of its height; it is great and high.
JT Everything is not stated at once in regard of the wall. The Spirit of God comes back to it. We are told that the extent of the wall is one hundred and forty-four cubits, which is twelve times twelve.
VCL The names of the twelve apostles are in the foundations of the wall. Where does Paul’s ministry come in?
JT It would be in the pearl, I suppose, but the twelve apostles of the Lamb are referred to here, as if God would say to us now that what He began with was perfect in itself. He had supplied all that was needed for the administration of the assembly in Acts 2. If He added more, as in the gospels, in adding the seventy to the twelve who were sent out, it was just to show how liberal and how careful He was. But the twelve were enough; there was the idea of perfection in the twelve.
VCL The Lord said to the twelve, in John 6, “Will ye also go away?” Is Peter’s answer suggestive of the foundations?
JT Just so. Peter answers, “to whom shall we go?” That is the secret of the preservation of the strength of the wall. Peter was a symbol of the wall.
[p. 456] Although it is said that one of the twelve was a devil yet the power was with the twelve.
AAT Why does it speak of a man’s measure?
JT I think it is to bring out that man has a place; He has the leading place in instrumentality — even above angels. But it is a man’s measure; showing that it is not infinite measure or power. It is limited, as you get in Ephesians: “... that ye may be fully able to apprehend with all the saints what is the breadth and length and depth and height; and to know the love of the Christ which surpasses knowledge”, (Ephesians 3:18,19). The breadth and length and depth and height do not surpass knowledge. They are creature limitations.
AR To what extent will the assembly have influence in the millennium?
JT Well, it will be paramount, and universal. A subdivision of rule and influence is seen in what the Lord says to the disciples, that they shall sit on twelve thrones. We shall judge angels, but the apostles are seen as judging the twelve tribes of Israel; but they belong to the assembly. It is the subdivisional idea.
ABP In Isaiah 60 it says, “Arise, shine! for thy light is come”, verse 1. Is there any connection with the thought here of “her shining”?
JT I think so. It shows how the earthly Jerusalem will correspond with the heavenly, and I think an examination of Ezekiel would show that. We have the heavenly here, but it is evident that John was conversant with the prophecy of Ezekiel. The facts given here are similar, and appear to allude to what had been said before, only with additional thoughts, which are very interesting. God has reserved the best for the last. The heavenly has the first place. Therefore, Jerusalem above is our mother, whereas Jerusalem below is dealt with in Galatians 2.
RWS In Malachi 4:2 it says, “And unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings”. Does that allude to the Lord personally in the millennium or is it what He does through the assembly?
JT Both things might be true; it might be through the assembly. The Lord said the disciples would do greater things than He because He went to the Father. Some think that the Lord will not appear at all except through the assembly but it would seem from the prophetic word that He will. At the same time, it ought to be kept in mind that the assembly is the vessel in which He is expressed.
AAT The precious stones are mentioned as adorning the foundations. Is that an additional thought?
JT “The foundations of the wall of the city were adorned with every precious stone”, showing the extraordinary grandeur involved, because a foundation ordinarily would not be adorned. What is needed, primarily, is strength. Then we have a list of twelve precious stones which appear in the foundations. This stresses the wonderful wealth and beauty of the system, because the foundations are made so much of. Therefore, they are evidently displayed, not buried, as is customary. They are evidently visible because of their beautification and adornment. The whole system, therefore, is marked off as apostolic. It is the best that God has produced, and if He adds something more it is Paul, but the twelve imply the best that God has produced. Therefore when one was missing, Matthias was selected; there must be the number twelve.
TEH Peter said that he would go into death for the Lord, and while he denied Him, yet he did go to martyrdom. Do these precious stones for the foundations suggest suffering love coming to light under tremendous pressure so that the apostles would shine in the foundations?
JT I suppose so; it is a question of the use of the precious stones; and then there is the idea of the pearls,
[p. 458] too. The very best that God has produced is implied in the heavenly city.
RTM In what way does the number twelve show the idea of love?
JT Because it is so divisible, and flexible in its computation. What a wonderful interchange there is in the number! You cannot compute seven in the same sense. That number stands by itself. You must work things out from some other viewpoint to get the value of seven, but twelve is a number that is divisible. It would suggest that the brethren have no difficulty in taking each other’s places or in standing aside for each other. It is a question of love and it is like that chapter in 1 Corinthians of which it is said, “Yet shew I unto you a way of more surpassing excellence”, chapter 12:31. That is the number twelve, I would say.
JTJr Peter stood up with the eleven; that is, the idea of twelve is made up there, and then later the twelve sent Peter and John down to Samaria.
JT Just so; they sent two of them; that is good.
ANW That must be why the names of the twelve tribes of Israel are rearranged in so many different ways throughout the Bible.
JT Yes; that serves to bring out what the number means. Our selection of this subject of administration works out in the matter of love. It is a question of how much love we have, because the number will disappear if the love is not there. We must keep the thought of the twelve intact.
CN Would it be right to say that this administration is not so much the suppression of evil as it is the unfolding of the love of God and the manifestation of His love in glory?
JT Quite so; therefore a comparison may be made of the lake of fire and heaven. Heaven is viewed in Scripture as the most blessed place in the creation, and all that connects with blessedness and glory and love [p. 459] are found there. On the other hand, there is the lake of fire. How terrible that is! The necessity of love requires the lake of fire. It would be intolerable beyond words that there should be a continuation of wickedness without complete restriction or hindrance. The idea of the lake is one of limitation — to limit or hinder wickedness. This is the necessity of love, and the more we see that, the more we shall understand why so much is made of it in the gospel.
JAP Is this the city that Abraham waited for?
JT That is what I would say. It is the city “whose builder and maker is God”. There is no imperfection in it.
AR What nations shall be saved as indicated in verse 24?
JT Well, they are the saved nations after the present position of Christendom. I would say that the area called Christendom will become apostate and will be judged unmitigatingly at the end, but there will be saved nations, and I should think that they would be more the eastern ones. The east is where the angel with the everlasting gospel will fly in mid-heaven. I do not think there will be any hope at all or any provision made for the salvation of Christendom again. Its time will be over.
CAM Would you say that Matthew 12:20, 21: “... until he bring forth judgment unto victory; and on his name shall the nations hope” would look forward to the millennial day?
JT Quite so; but it would apply to the gospel day, too, as in Romans 15:12. The prophetic allusion to the saved nations would, I think, have in mind those in the east, especially those sections of the earth that have not been evangelised.
ABP Would the nations in Matthew 25 which are referred to as the sheep which enter into everlasting life, be the nations referred to here as [p. 460] the saved nations?
JT Quite so; they would be the saved nations and the others go into everlasting judgment. The nations bring their glory into the city, showing how all contributes to the fulfilment of God’s promises to Israel, and the great place the assembly is to have.
VCL Should those who preach seek to have power in their service in the gospel so that Christendom will have a true presentation in the closing days of the dispensation?
JT I think that is good. The truth is being opened up, and has been since the time of the revival. First it was in relation to the prophetic map, and then the assembly, and then the house of God and the gospel, and then eternal life, and then later the service of God in the assembly and local administration. I believe all these features have been opened up, and are being opened up, in view of those who have part in the assembly going to heaven intelligently. The apostle could say, “I speak as to intelligent persons”. That has been greatly stressed in relation to the Lord’s supper.
CN Will you say a word on verses 22 and 23?
JT “And I saw no temple in it; for the Lord God Almighty is its temple, and the Lamb. And the city has no need of the sun nor of the moon, that they should shine for it; for the glory of God has enlightened it, and the lamp thereof is the Lamb”. This shows that there is no need of natural light. The greatest natural ability in the human race has no place in it at all. The epistle to the Colossians is the secret to all this, there is no natural light needed at all. We do not need philosophy nor vain deceit, nor do we need Judaism.
APT The presence of divine Persons in the city is what gives it light and glory. “The glory of God has enlightened it, and the lamp thereof is the Lamb”. And in verse 9 it says, “Come here, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb’s wife”. And the last verse says, “... the book of life of the Lamb“
JT It is to bring out the greatness of the system, I think, that divine Persons are known in it. They are known, and distinguishable in it too, which is another important matter as to whom we are hearing and from whom we are getting light. The title Father is not used here; it is God. You can distinguish between God Himself and the mediatorial Person, the Son, and also the Holy Spirit.
GH Would the title Lord God Almighty emphasise the immense greatness of the whole system?
JT Yes; and it would show also that the Lord is operating as from the beginning. The assembly is a thought by itself, yet it was in the mind of God from the beginning. The Lord God Almighty is the light that Abraham had. Jehovah is the light that Israel had, and the Father is the light that we have. We do not get the Father in this book, in the sense of our relation with Him, as we do in John’s gospel.
SW We have been saying that this is a millennial setting. But do we not get the gain by writing ourselves into it? The Lord said to His disciples, “Yet in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subjected to you, but rejoice that your names are written in the heavens”, (Luke 10:20).
JT We belong to the heavenly. We are not millennial saints. They will learn from us, and they will look up on us. We shall look down on them. Saints of this dispensation shall be ruling over cities in the millennium.
WWM Would the measure of the golden reed be the standard by which we take things up in the care meetings? If we are thinking of the city, and of the gates, and of the wall, and if we are measuring matters from the divine standpoint, we should always arrive at the right judgment in any matters that are before us.
JT These scriptures in Revelation help us even though they refer to what is future. They are apostolic [p. 462] writings, showing that they serve as Scripture to us. They have authority with us. It comes up constantly that brethren acknowledge that they have been linked up with unconverted people in business and in other ways such as mixed marriages, for example. That means they are disregarding the height of the wall. And so in many other instances we can see how these scriptures in Revelation, although largely in different expressions and terms than the epistles, have a voice to us. They regulate us, especially in regard of the wall. It is all a question of having regard for the commandments of God.
RWS Is this like the city of truth in Zechariah in which the boys and girls will play in the streets? The walls would be there.
JT You are not free to let your children engage in what is in the streets now. There is that to cause us to fear. One often has said that Satan rules in the street but God rules in the house. But in the millennium the boys and girls will play in the streets, and there is no danger or fear in them. Even old people can sit there and commune together.
CN The street of the city is of pure gold as transparent glass.
JTJr Many of these things that you have been speaking of which are allowed amongst us would becloud the shining. If there are any evil mixtures in our localities the shining would be hindered. God would see it and the angels would see it.
JT How constantly we hear of trade unionism, mixed marriages, alliances in business; all beclouding us and beclouding others. Whereas in this scripture the use made of the wall is so plain. We are in a divine enclosure and God would protect us in it. We are to remain there and not go out into the place of defilement. We have the allusion to what is defiling in verse 15 of the last chapter, “Without are the dogs, and the [p. 463] sorcerers, and the fornicators, and the murderers, and the idolaters, and every one that loves and makes a lie”. That is over against verse 14, which is: “Blessed are they that wash their robes, that they may have right to the tree of life, and that they should go in by the gates into the city”.
APT Chapter 21:27 says, “Nothing common, nor that maketh an abomination and a lie, shall at all enter into it; but those only who are written in the book of life of the Lamb”.
JT Just so; all these things are most solemn and directly apply to us now as the word of God. “Every scripture is divinely inspired, and profitable for teaching, for conviction, for correction, for instruction in righteousness; that the man of God may be complete, fully fitted to every good work”, (2 Timothy 3:16,17).
GVD What do you understand by the statement, “its length is as much as the breadth”?
JT That is, the city lies foursquare, according to verse 16 — “And its length is as much as the breadth. And he measured the city with the reed — twelve thousand stadia: the length and the breadth and height of it are equal”. The height is given, too. The one statement supposes a square and the other a cube; that is to say, the solidity of the city in its substance is in mind in the latter. How solid it is! Whereas the other is the measure of a square. I think the idea of the cube is carried through here, and is very important.
AMacD You spoke about the personnel in the city. At each gate is an angel. How do the angels fit in here?
JT I suppose that they come in according to what is said in Hebrews 1:14, “Are they not all ministering spirits, sent out for service on account of those who shall inherit salvation?” They are sent out for service, and I suppose it is in God’s mind that He would bring in all that is in creation; He approves them although they are not men. He uses them. I suppose that is what is [p. 464] meant. And they are subservient to those that are heirs of salvation, showing that mean are the greatest persons.
RWS The throne of God is mentioned in chapter 22:1, “And he shewed me a river of water of life, bright as crystal, going out of the throne of God and of the Lamb”. Is that operation a millennial thought through the assembly, too?
JT Quite so, I would say it is millennial in this section of chapter 22; in fact what we have been speaking of is all millennial. “And he shewed me a river of water of life, bright as crystal, going out of the throne of God and of the Lamb. In the midst of its street, and of the river, on this side and on that side, the tree of life, producing twelve fruits, in each month yielding its fruit; and the leaves of the tree for healing of the nations”. That is millennial. But then it says, “And no curse shall be any more”, which points on again to eternal conditions. “And the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him, and they shall see his face; and his name is on their foreheads. And night shall not be any more”. We have come to eternal conditions, again. And then it says, “And no need of a lamp, and light of the sun; for the Lord God shall shine upon them, and they shall reign to the ages of ages”. The Lamb is not mentioned in this part. It is more looking toward the eternal state of things.
RWS This magnifies what we have been having as to the greatness of the assembly. The throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it.
JT This shows, I think, the whole position in mind in the opening of chapter 22 is to bring out the transparency there is in the assembly, and of course that should mark us now. We should be together in transparency with each other, without evil thoughts or motives or pride or ambition. All that is to be dissipated by this remarkable passage in chapter 22. While in [p. 465] truth what we get from verse 9 on in chapter 21 is millennial, and so is this chapter, Yet the external state is there, too. There is a sort of mixed allusion to millennial conditions, and at the same time, eternal conditions, because in truth they go along together.
ABP Is there a present application in John’s epistle: “But if we walk in the light as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another”, (1 John 1:7)?
JT Just so; a very good word, too — “with one another” — without any discrimination.
SW Would the throne of God and of the Lamb be one throne or two separate thrones?
JT In this book, separate thrones are referred to. The Lord speaks of His own throne, which He does not occupy now. He speaks of His Father’s throne, on which He is now seated. But He is going to leave His Father’s throne to take up His own throne in view of ruling the millennial world. This verse refers to “the throne of God and of the Lamb”.
AR There is only one street in this city. I suppose that suggests that our fellowship should be the same.
JT Quite so — one street is quite intelligible. It says of Peter that he went down one street when he came out of prison in Acts 12 and then he went to Mary’s house, and he found Rhoda, who is a victorious damsel. I am referring to these things in a general way, but they are most important things. There is no idea of an aristocratic section in the heavenly city.
ANW There is no ‘second quarter’ in that city either.
Rem In chapter 22: 4, it says, “And they shall see his face”.
JT That is the idea of service. It is a question if that is God, personally, except as seen in Christ. It is oft-times difficult to distinguish in John’s writings.