THE GLORY OF CHRIST (2)

THE GLORY OF CHRIST (2)

Hebrews 2: 9 - 13; Hebrews 7: 23 - 28; Hebrews 8: 1, 2; Hebrews 10: 19 - 25

SMcC The presentation of the glory of Christ in this letter to the Hebrew Christians, has in mind very specially their detachment from Judaism which had such a great place in the ways of God, being the highest dispensed form of government in the ways of God. The writer no doubt by external and internal evidences, is thought to be Paul, though we are not told actually that it was Paul, but the style seems to be Paul’s, so that we can see how the heavenly side has such a place in this epistle. The great strength and stability of the system takes character from Christ and all is made to hang on Him, because of who He is. In this epistle we not only have His humanity wondrously projected on to our view, but we also have His deity, linking on with what we had in “the root and offspring of David”, and there is a certain analogy in the letter, and the writing of it, to ourselves and our own position, in that the overthrow of the world’s system is imminent, as was the overthrow of Jerusalem when this letter was written. It is generally thought that the letter was 67 A.D. and the overthrow was 70 A.D., and the letter has in mind the extrication of the believers from the system here below which so held and affected them. No doubt there was, as the letter would show, a certain falling away with some and a certain, perhaps, discouragement with others, and the presentation of the glory of Christ in the letter has in mind powerfully to affect them and draw them out of that in which there was a tendency to be held. In these passages which we have read we have reference to the Lord Jesus in different ways. “The leader of their salvation” is a very fine reference to Christ in this exalted setting,

bringing in how great the salvation of the many sons is, involving, as it does, the divine pleasure and the divine praise, and then we have reference in the second section that we read, to the High Priest, His exalted character, and the exalted character of the saints and their heavenly calling, so that such a High Priest became them, and then the minister of the holy place, or the minister of the sanctuary. These are very fine references to Christ, calculated to affect our souls, drawing them out of things here and into the vast universal scene of glory where He is the Centre and God is known so blessedly. Then we have the last reference to the great Priest, and drawing near, especially in view of the day approaching, that is the consummation of things that we have had before us. The first chapter draws attention to the glory of Christ in His deity, but here we come to what affects our souls in reference to His humanity, “But now we see not yet all things subjected to him, but we see Jesus, who was made some little inferior to angels on account of the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour”. The epistle opens up the great realm in which Jesus is, so scornfully and ignominiously treated at Calvary, bruised and spat upon by the leaders of Judaism, but now in the scene of glory above, saluted by God as the hymn says, “The Father’s greetings - honours rare - are heaped upon His Son’s blest brow” (350:2). He is well worthy of them.

AH Would you add a word with regard to your reference to the exalted character of our salvation?

SMcC I thought the setting of it here involved the part and place we have in the great thought of sonship, “bringing many sons to glory”; first of all “it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things”, an allusion to God in the relation in which He comes on to our view. I think it particularly links with John’s presentation of God in the thought of the Father, with whom the “all things” are linked all the way through the gospel of John. Sonship is in mind, first in Christ, of course, seen so specially, and then by implication in the saints, so that our salvation involves the thought of glory and then we have the thought of the brethren of Christ in verse 11, and the praise of God in verse 12.

MHT Do you think that Stephen would be a good example of one who set forward this matter at the beginning when he bears testimony to the fact that he saw the heavens opened through, and he saw Jesus standing at the right hand of God?

SMcC Yes, I suppose Stephen in the setting there would link with the epistle to the Hebrews, the thought of the opened heavens would enter into this letter. Stephen is not under the power of the circumstances, he is detached from them in spirit.

PHH Is the divine speaking according to the beginning of the epistle, “God having spoken in ... Son” to present the attractiveness of the speaking that it should be in such a setting? Mr. Darby’s note ‘c’, the latter part of it, “It is God himself who speaks; not by another; not as the Father nor in the Person of the Father; not merely by the Holy Spirit, but as himself a divine Person, and that Person the Son”. Does that make the Sonship of Christ, in that setting, a very peculiarly attractive and pleasurable presentation of His Person?

SMcC Well, it does and shows how closely the thought of His deity is linked with His Sonship, that while His Sonship alludes to His place in humanity, yet linked with it is the powerful reference to the Person, and who He is, and the character of the speaking here would be in contrast to all that has gone before, and, rather than in comparison, it would stand out in contrast to the speaking before, the elevated, exalted character of the expression of God that this letter opens with.

PHH Does that character of sonship more or less pervade the epistle?

SMcC It does, so that in the matter of His priesthood, and His installation in the priestly office on high, His sonship is brought into the subject, and we see how His priesthood is based upon His sonship, but it is also based upon His eternal personality, like we have the interlacing of the gold in Exodus 28 and 29 in the priestly garments par excellence so we have the interweaving of these great thoughts in regard to Christ’s priesthood in this letter.

PHH So if we are speaking about the sonship of the saints, while, of course, He in His Person, is unique, yet does He, in a sense, make the standard of the sonship of the saints? God bringing many sons to glory, are they extremely dignified persons?

SMcC They are. That a divine Person should have come into the relationship of Son, as viewed in this letter, to bring out the great thought, of not what God is arbitrarily exactly in the exercise of His power, but what He is in His nature in the opening out of His heart, is a very wonderful matter. While sonship was placed in the human family at the outset, yet it looked on to the Incarnation, and to the greatness of the moment when a divine Person would come into that relation, and it would be seen in a way in which it was never seen before.

AJG And now seen in its final form in Christ in glory?

SMcC Exactly; the word ‘perfect’ is interesting in that relation. It would bear now on the great thought in glory that He has reached in manhood, a position and state, which is according to God’s purpose for man.

CMM Would the glory of Christ in chapters 1 and 2, “the root and offspring”, help as to an understanding of His mediatorial position, Mediator of God and man?

SMcC It would very much because the new name would embrace, as was referred to this morning, the renown linked with the great fact that not only do we see Man perfectly in Him towards God, but we also see God perfectly in Him towards man. In the mediatorial realm out of which we never go, Christ is apprehended according to the renown that stands related to these great things.

AJG So that the gospel of John was written so that we might “believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing ye might have life in his name”, John 20: 31. Does that bring in the thought of a great realm filled with the renown of Christ in which we find our life?

SMcC That is the point. John would, in his ministry, greatly impress us with that, the great realm in which Christ in His mediatorial glory stands out so uniquely and as linked with and attached to Him in that realm, we find our life, indeed He is said to be our life, life is in Him, of course, but He is said to be our life.

PHH Would you say another word about the word translated ‘leader’, “to make perfect the leader of their salvation”. It is referred to elsewhere as we know - what is the precise setting of it?

SMcC The note in Acts 3 helps as to the literal meaning of the word. It says, “This word is difficult to render in English. It is a ‘leader’, but it is more. It is used for one who begins and sets a matter on”. That is very fine in regard to the context in Hebrews 2, we get it again in Hebrews 12, it means He began and finished the whole course. I think it helps us as to this matter of sonship, the leader of our salvation in this relation. He began the matter and has set it on; so John’s gospel helps us as to that.

PHH Is the matter which He sets on all the greater on account of His Person?

SMcC I thought so. We have heard John 17 alluded to in the sense that we are in the presence of the Minister of the sanctuary, but it affects us to think too we are in the presence of the Leader of our salvation. The many sons who are being brought to glory, “the leader of their salvation” is speaking to the Father, speaking to God in the way in which He is known in the parental relation in John’s gospel, and He is speaking about their salvation. He begins with the thought of eternal life, and He ends with the thought of sonship, that is that we might be with Him where He is.

AH In view of all that, is not there something very touching in that reference, “For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things”?

SMcC I think there is. The “all things” are very interesting in that light. You notice how full the subject is in John’s gospel as God comes on to our view in the paternal relation in that gospel, the all things are constantly referred to in relation to Him, but then it says, “The Father loves the Son, and has given all things to be in his hand” (John 3: 35), that is the Mediator comes on to our view in the mediatorial system operating in relation to the all things.

AH So do you take it that “it became him”, is as if that is a kind of reference to an added glory attaching to God that He should operate thus?

SMcC I think so, because heretofore, as indicated in the previous chapter, He had been known in many ways. We get Genesis opening with the great blessedness of God in the supremacy of His Being, Elohim, a Being to be worshipped in that sense, the sense of His supremeness. Then you get Jehovah Elohim, then you get El Shaddai, the Almighty, then you get Jehovah, but when we come to this movement towards men in Christ in the New Testament, we have God coming into the paternal relation that John refers to in his gospel and seen in such wondrous glory in it, and it says, “For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons to glory, to make perfect the leader of their salvation through sufferings”. I think there is a definite link with the ministry of John’s gospel in the way that this is alluded to.

AHG Have you in mind that the word ‘salvation’ would involve our being brought into all these blessings of which you have spoken, the enjoyment of them?

SMcC Yes, I think the salvation has in mind the glory, the “bringing many sons to glory”, and in order that that should be so, extrication is needed, so that what colours John’s gospel in that relation is what is ‘up‘ on the way out of the world, involving our salvation.

RHS Could you say something about the thought of “through sufferings”?

SMcC Well, what a touching reference that is It is “to make perfect the leader of their salvation”, not through death, the word ‘death’ is employed a little bit earlier, but here it says, “through sufferings”, as if we are to be reminded of the particular aspect of the sufferings of Christ in this relation.

EJH Would glory be put upon the persons of whom it is said by the Lord, “They are not of the world, as I am not of the world”, John 17: 16?

SMcC That is what I thought, that the “bringing many sons to glory” links with what is in the Lord’s mind in John 17 as He speaks to the Father, and “the leader of their salvation through sufferings” involves, “I sanctify myself”, only here it became God in this relation, but there the Lord is in perfect accord with it, He sanctified Himself. That is all the suffering of going through death and into glory via that way, was in His mind.

AJG There would have been something lacking in the light in which God was known, if this matter of suffering had not been entered into.

SMcC Exactly, so that it touches the moral side in that sense which gives great lustre to the glory of this Person in our eyes if we can so speak of it, that there is this added thought of glory. He was all-glorious in Himself as to His Person, perfect and complete, but the coming via this way, as it were, becoming an effective means of bringing on to our view His glory in a unique way through suffering.

JR I would like to ask whether the reference to Psalm 8 in verse 9, and the addition of the words “on account of the suffering of death”, link on with the thought expressed as to the sufferings in verse 10.

SMcC I think so, that is part of the sufferings of Christ. The “suffering of death”, it is a very striking expression, because it was not only necessary that the Lord should endure the active sufferings on the cross, but it was necessary that He should enter death itself, and think of what that experience was to Him passively as we take account of the “pains of death” as alluded to in Acts 2: 24.

JTS Does this emphasise for us the necessity and the desirability, too, of suffering, the Hebrew saints had clearly taken up this matter? Are we to do this and to be prepared to suffer - “ye endured much conflict of sufferings”, chapter 10: 32.

SMcC We would learn from the leader of our salvation in that way how He went through suffering, and that is to affect us, because detachment from things here would involve suffering, but He has gone through suffering in view of these thoughts being reached.

FCM I was thinking of the word of Jehovah through Moses to Pharaoh, “Let my son go, that he may serve me” (Exodus 4: 23). Would that be intended to effect our complete extrication from the world, the world having no claim to us, involving suffering, but having in mind the glorious system?

SMcC Yes, I think in effect it would. God had in mind the wilderness there, that they would serve Him on that mountain in the wilderness. Of course, Hebrews generally is a wilderness epistle, it is dealing with our position in responsibility and our position in the wilderness, but these few verses here really carry us outside of the wilderness. It is as if they are brought in to give tone and substance, as apprehended by us and our souls are affected by them, to the great service of God in the sanctuary, for the letter has in mind the sanctuary and our position in it under the hand of Christ.

GWB In this connection do you think it is suitable in the service of God, particularly in addressing the Lord, that there should be some reference to His sufferings or otherwise?

SMcC I do not think we can forget His sufferings in this exalted relation, because the point, of course, is not to focus our attention on the suffering, but rather on the Leader of our salvation, but He has been perfected through suffering. He has reached the position in which He is to be taken account of as viewed here through suffering. The suffering is not the end but the means to the end.

GWB One might just add, I have been told recently that there is still difficulty with some in regard to the use of Hymn 8 in the service of God, because of the reference to the Lord and His path, which would include His suffering. The suggestion is that we are beyond that, and I was wondering whether what you have been saying has a bearing on that, and whether it would be helpful.

SMcC I think it helps to see how the truth is presented in this epistle, that certain things are brought in that are incidental. They are not the prime thought, but they are brought in and, as it were, project added glory on to our view in relation to the Person, and that is how I understand Hymn 8. Suffering is not the prime thought in the hymn, it is the Person, but these things are referred to in relation to the Person, as only serving to make the glory of the Person more stand out before our souls.

DJH I was thinking in connection with that, of the sufferings of the Christ and the glories to follow. It is the glories that are in view, sufferings being the way to it.

SMcC Just so.

PHH Does the fact that the sufferings here are not detailed at all, serve to steep our minds in the feature of suffering, so that in the wilderness we would accept it as being part of our pathway there, just as we gladly accept the glory of the service in the sanctuary? Would the sufferings in that sense, of Christ in one sense, of the saints in another, serve to give us a balanced mind about it all?

SMcC I think they would, and also the passage in 2 Corinthians 4 as to the eternal weight of glory, as it says, “For our momentary and light affliction works for us in surpassing measure an eternal weight of glory; while we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things that are not seen; for the things that are seen are for a time, but those that are not seen eternal” (verses 17, 18). Well, this is one of the things that are not seen, “bringing many sons to glory” opens up the great unseen spiritual realm. The affliction, as it were, is affected by that in our minds, and instead of falling under the power of circumstances, which have such preponderance in our minds at times we are affected by what is eternal.

HW Does it help to see that these quotations which follow are from Psalm 22, giving us the account of the greatest sufferings of Christ, with the accomplishment of the great work of redemption, and do we not have in Scripture, various references to the depth of response that flows from that glorious work?

SMcC So that Psalm 22 is the great suffering Psalm. We might say the intensest form of suffering is before us in Psalm 22, and yet what emerges from it all, is what is on our view here, what is for God and the praises of Israel, the praises of the assembly.

HW And extending to the ends of the earth.

SMcC Just so.

GHSP It is John in his gospel who brings in the blood-shedding on the cross. Does that have any bearing on this exalted level of suffering?

SMcC Well, it does, and the blood would always affect our souls in that sense, keeping in mind that all that bears upon the public side, the doorway to the great divine system, the portal to the great realm of glory.

EJH If I remember rightly, Mr. Taylor has said something like this, that it depends on what is in the mind and heart of the priest when he is serving, as to what he gives expression to.

SMcC Yes.

EJB In verse 10, God is the Operator, in verse 11 the stress is on what Christ is doing, does that link with your subject as to the prominence given to Christ in this section?

SMcC Yes, it does. It is very affecting in verses 11 and 12, how the Lord comes on to our view. Reference was made this morning to the fact that the Spirit comes on to our view in His personal dignity in Revelation 22, speaking to the Lord Jesus along with the bride, here there comes on to our view, another setting in which one divine Person speaks to Another as standing related to those He is not ashamed to call His brethren, saying, “I will declare thy name to my brethren; in the midst of the assembly will I sing thy praises”. Think of the glory of Christ in the perfection of His humanity as it comes on to our view here in regard to the great service of God.

FWK Is verse 11 from the divine side, and would the bearing of it have a detaching effect upon us?

SMcC I thought it would, that is, we have got the highest and fullest aspect of sanctification here, “For both he that sanctifies and those sanctified are all of one”; what a detaching effect that would have on us, because how could we have part in anything common or anything that would be degrading to our privileged part in this light, if we were firmly in the good and gain of what is here?

HW Does this thought “all of one” take us back again to John 17, and the Lord’s wonderful words there with regard to His own, in sanctifying Himself in view of this great matter that we should be all of one; speaking to His Father with regard to it?

SMcC Yes, the difference between the two would be that here in Hebrews 2 it is the great work of Himself that is presented, “he that sanctifies”; our sanctification in John 17; “that they also may be sanctified” (verse 19); has in mind that we come into it through the bearing and application of the truth upon us, the truth of His position in glory, working out practically in our detachment from things here as we are attached to Him in glory.

PHH Would that peculiarly affect us as having an attachment to His Person in Manhood, being His brethren, and being said to be “all of one”? Does that mean all of the same holy stock and lineage the other side of death?

SMcC Just so, and what follows flows out of that, as if to impress us with the dignity of the whole matter, and this should greatly affect us in our lives practically, not only in the assembly on Lord’s day morning, but it should have a great effect on our lives practically, “he that sanctifies and those sanctified are all of one; for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren, saying”, that is, we have got a continuous matter here, “saying, I will declare thy name to my brethren; in the midst of the assembly will I sing thy praises”.

BGH Would you say a word in connection with that, as to the service of God?

SMcC What do you have in mind?

BGH It is not necessarily limited to the name of the Father, is it? “I will declare thy name to my brethren”.

SMcC I think we have to take the context as to what is in mind and to keep in mind the whole bearing of the epistle. Hebrews presents God in the majesty of His Being in a remarkable way, and redemption is effected in the course of divine operations, and we are set free and brought right into the presence of that majestic Being as revealed in Christ, but then we have to make full room in our minds for the different relations in which God in His majesty is presented; for instance, it is Son-wise in the first chapter, God Son-wise; it is the same Being in all His majesty, but He is presented Son-wise. In chapter 2: 10 - 12, it is God parental-wise, the whole subject in the context is family relationships, the sons and the brethren; it is God parental-wise and the wonderful glory that attaches to Him in this light, “bringing many sons to glory”, making “perfect the leader of their salvation through sufferings”, and then, “for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren, saying, I will declare thy name to my brethren”; which links with John 17, “And I have made known to them thy name, and will make it known; that the love with which thou hast loved me may be in them and I in them” (verse 26), the “I in them” links with what we have here in verse 12, “in the midst of the assembly will I sing thy praises”, and it links with the new name in Philadelphia, the promise to the overcomer, “my new name”.

AWP Why do we not get the name of the Father in Hebrews, as Mr. Raven taught so firmly?

SMcC Mr. Darby pointed it out, too. Hebrews is a wilderness epistle. It does not develop family relationships, and these verses that we have here ordinarily are not part of the general teaching of the epistle; they are like features of glory brought into the epistle to affect the general position, but in their substance they lie outside of the wilderness position. For instance sonship in relation to glory lies outside the wilderness position; the brethren of Christ is a thought that lies outside the wilderness position; in the midst of the assembly is a thought which lies outside the wilderness position, it is the assembly according to purpose and counsel.

RGB Has it not been said that these two verses are perhaps the highest point in the epistle, linking perhaps more directly in their teaching with Ephesians?

SMcC Yes; so that we may have thoughts brought into letters, as we have in Romans in another relation, and as we have in this section in Hebrews, which link us with higher levels of the truth than are in mind in the general teaching of the epistle.

FWK Is that why the third chapter begins “Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling”? I wondered whether it would confirm what you are saying as to the book generally contemplating the saints as in the wilderness, but they are a heavenly people.

SMcC Yes. The epistle generally takes account of them as in the wilderness and therefore there is a powerful ministry to help them in that setting.

PHH The mention of these details in verses 10, 11 and 12, are they like rays of glory to encourage us onwards, without opening out what they mean in fulness?

SMcC I think so; I think that is the point, and especially to affect our souls in relation to Christ’s humanity, that is, in the wonderful position in which He is viewed here as declaring the name of God to His brethren and in the midst of the assembly singing God’s praises, and as it says, “again, I will trust in him”. All is pointing to His humanity in this wonderful and unique setting.

AJG Do you regard the assembly here in this verse as the assembly of such distinguished persons, the assembly of firstborn ones as we have later on in the epistle? It is a very wonderful company that the Lord should take His place in the midst of it and all who compose it are all of one with Him.

SMcC It is, indeed, and the epistle to the Hebrews is to help us to see the greatness of the saints in this setting, so that in the next passage “such a high priest became us”. Well, what could the reference be except to what the saints are according to the glorious thoughts that we are referring to in chapter 2? “Became us”, the ‘us’ would link on with these exalted thoughts as to the brethren of Christ and what the personnel of this great vessel is, “in the midst of the assembly will I sing thy praises”.

AH Would you think that this remarkable reference to the Lord, or really “he that sanctifies” singing in the midst of such persons who form the assembly, is to help us to be in that position feelingly?

SMcC I think so, and the sufferings and their apprehension by us, and what went earlier, “Jesus, who was made some little inferior to angels on account of the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour”; it would always augment the feeling side with us in view of what we have in these verses. When we come to chapter 7 we get the thought of the high priest and the minister of the holy places. We have already referred to the fact that it says, “For such a high priest became us”. We are to be impressed with the dignity of the saints according to their heavenly calling; they are no ordinary persons, therefore this in itself has a detaching effect upon us, and especially as apprehending the glory of Christ in His high priestly office in this relation.

FPS Why does the “Son perfected for ever” come in here?

SMcC It is to draw our attention to the great advantages that we have in the priestly system as we are now linked with it, because there are two things that throw into relief the contrast between the new system and the old, and that is the “swearing of the oath”, and the “Son perfected for ever”. That makes the priesthood of Christ unique in contrast to the old, because the “swearing of the oath” did not enter into the old priesthood, nor do we have the thought of the “Son perfected for ever”.

AJG So that the whole position is dignified by the glory of the One who is the High Priest.

SMcC That is it. That is we have the glory of Christ personally as giving its own touch to the whole system, and we have the glory of the saints too, as giving their touch to the system.

PHH Is that why the mind of the saints is built up in this great personage of Melchisedec? It says in verse 4, “Now consider how great this personage was”. Is the mind being built up in the greatness of His Person in order to reflect greatness on the saints?

SMcC It is. It is very interesting to see how Melchisedec in that way is brought in, the mystery linked with this personage, how he is brought in to throw into relief the glory of Christ as apprehended in relation to Christianity. We know from the opening of the chapter that Melchisedec met Abraham who was occupied with the detachment of Lot. The whole scene in which Melchisedec appears was linked with the detaching of Lot who had got into captive hands, and Abraham is blessed by Melchisedec as returning from this operation. It reminds us of how great this matter of detachment is, because it says of Christ here in regard to His priestly office and service, “he is able to save completely those who approach by him to God”.

AJG And the effect of Melchisedec’s service to Abraham was that Abraham refused to have even from a thread to a shoe latchet from the king of Sodom.

SMcC Is it not helpful to see how these things all link together? We see the complete independency of Abraham from the world system typified in the king of Sodom. This epistle is to help us in relation to all that in our attachment to Christ and our links with Him as the type is set out in Melchisedec, “a priest for ever”, as is referred to.

WMB Would you say a word as to the expression “become higher than the heavens”? Would that bear on what you are bringing before us as to His outstanding personal glory?

SMcC It would, that bears on what we were saying earlier, that interwoven in the subject of the Lord’s priestly office is this matter of His deity and His humanity - “higher than the heavens”, that could be said of no creature; it immediately projects on to our view the greatness of the Person, as One who was divine.

RHS Is that seen in the words, “because of his continuing for ever”?

SMcC That is it, that is there will be no breakdown in this. This chapter Hebrews 7 teaches us, in Jewish language, what Romans 7 teaches us in moral language in regard to our deliverance, that is there is a change of law and a change of system, and we have to go through that in our souls experimentally. We get, for instance, the law of fleshly commandment, that could bring in nothing perfect.

It is referred to in relation to its weakness and unprofitableness, for the law perfected nothing, but what we have come to is what perfects everything and what is marked by strength and profit, complete salvation.

PHH Is it not wonderful that we are said to have such an One, “We have such a one high priest ... minister of the holy places”? I suppose that refers back to the Lord Jesus, but in the setting of the type of Melchisedec. I was wondering whether the greatness of it might strike us afresh. In reading through about Melchisedec, we would think that He was a divine Person and so on, and yet the saints are said to have Him as a high priest.

SMcC “We have such”, the word ‘such’ is very fine in that relation, “We have such a one high priest, who has sat down on the right hand of the throne of the greatness in the heavens”. The mysterious reference to the “greatness in the heavens” is also calculated to affect our souls, how the Lord is viewed in that way in His humanity, alongside of Deity which is no doubt in mind in the expression “greatness in the heavens”.

JTS You made reference to “minister of the holy places”, have you something more in your mind to say as to that?

SMcC I think it links on with the new name, the renown of the Lord in the new name in the promise to the overcomer in Philadelphia, that over against what is passing away, old and decrepit as viewed in this epistle, and what is around us in Christendom, the Lord is taken account of by the assembly in the uniqueness of His renown as the “minister of the holy places”. What a glory attaches to Him in that relation, in the official position, leading the praises of the assembly in relation to God!

AH Is there attractiveness too in the way the Melchisedec priesthood is first touched upon, where it says, “within the veil”; as if to carry us right into the very presence of God Himself?

SMcC Well, that is very interesting. We have a reference to the holiest in the last passage that we read. It is interesting the dual reference to the holiest in Hebrews. The holiest is presented as a wilderness thought into which we have access individually, into the presence of God, but it is also presented in a great enlarged setting as in chapter 9, the presence of God, and the vast scene of glory in which Christ is seen so wondrously in it. So that in chapter 10 we get a very practical bearing of it in relation to our apprehension of Christ. Earlier the chapter had been referring to His coming into humanity and taking away the first that He might establish the second, then it says, “Having therefore, brethren, boldness for entering into the holy of holies by the blood of Jesus, the new and living way which he has dedicated for us through the veil, that is, his flesh, and having a great priest over the house of God, let us approach with a true heart, in full assurance of faith, sprinkled as to our hearts from a wicked conscience, and washed as to our body with pure water”. We have been speaking about the exalted thoughts that attach to us in the epistle, now we come to this practical exhortation as to drawing near, that we are to see to these matters in approaching, of a true heart, hearts sprinkled from a wicked conscience, and bodies washed with pure water.

AH Is it of note therefore that such a word as this is addressed to persons who are said to be worshippers once purged?

SMcC It is, this chapter is dealing with the worshippers. The law could not perfect the worshippers, it could not perfect those who approach. Chapter 9 opens up the sanctuary, and how the way has been cleared in relation to the realm where God is served, but chapter 10 brings on to view the worshippers and how the worshippers are perfected through the work of Christ. But here we come to our moral exercises, for we cannot draw near or approach in any kind of way, we draw near in keeping with all that has been wrought in a mediatorial way by Christ.

HW In the second chapter of Ephesians we read how that we have come near, “Ye who once were afar off are become nigh by the blood of the Christ” (verse 13). Here in Hebrews, the verse we are looking at, it is “by the blood of Jesus” - would you say something as to that?

SMcC I thought it was a personal reference that would be particularly calculated to touch our feelings. In the previous chapter where the official side is seen in relation to the sanctuary, it is constantly “the blood of the Christ”, that anointed One, the great divine Operator, but when you come to boldness for approach and encouraging us to draw near, it is the “blood of Jesus”, and then it is “through the veil”. It is not the rent veil as we notice, it is an allusion to the humanity of Jesus and how it has become instrumental in this matter of our drawing near, and then he added a thought “having a great priest over the house of God”. Everything is conducive to our drawing near in keeping with what divine Persons have done.

SGB Does the blood of Jesus make our approach a heart matter?

SMcC I think so, that is what we were referring to as touching the spiritual emotions and feelings. Then “the new and living way” links on with the way into the full apprehension and contemplation of the Lord’s glory in relation to His new name, with which the service of God and the minister of the sanctuary have a peculiar link.

GHSP Would you carry forward into that the allusion to Christ as the One who has the key of David, in view of opening up the best in connection with the service of God?

SMcC Exactly, it involves that. It is striking that the address to Philadelphia begins with the key of David, the holy and the true. That is, you would expect the persons in Philadelphia standing related to Christ, to be in consistency with that, and that is what Hebrews 10 is stressing, that the persons are to be in consistency in the approach to God through Christ, in practical holiness, washed as to their body with pure water.