THE BEARING OF PETER'S EPISTLES ON THE PRESENT DAY (2)
THE BEARING OF PETER’S EPISTLES ON THE PRESENT DAY (2)
JT We have already alluded to the ability of Peter to set out the truth. It would be difficult to find a more striking evidence of ability than we have in this chapter — ability to denounce error, for almost every word of this chapter denounces error. No doubt it is needful that this should come before us at the present time because there is great ability abroad in the way of language; as I was remarking, you could hardly find anything so strong and effective as this second chapter of Peter’s second epistle, and undoubtedly the Lord would say something to us as to the error that is abroad in the world.
JTJr You are specially thinking of the recent doctrine that has been promulgated?
JT Yes; I was referring to the error of Rome as to Mary, the mother of our Lord, one of the most bare-faced statements of error that could be produced.
Ques In chapter one of this epistle the truth is presented positively, whereas here it is dealing with things in a negative way. Mr. Darby opens up the truth to the saints in his book The Irrationalism of Infidelity, would that be like this?
JT Very much like it. We surely can thank God that He raised up such a man to lead, in the denouncing of error, inclusive of that held by the Romish church.
CAM It is remarkable that the terrible conditions of evil go back so far. God spared not the angels who sinned, but cast them down. Would you say that it is necessary for all this matter of evil through these many years to work itself out? Would it be God’s way to allow the thing to develop? I was thinking of verses 4 and 5, “God spared not the angels who had sinned”, and “spared not the old world”. Has He allowed these things to go on, to show how impregnable the truth is all through [p. 360] history?
JT Very good. You marvel that the truth really has been able to stand all these centuries; it has been able to stand, defended by such ability as God gave certain ones, Mr. Darby and others like him, perhaps no one like him in modern times. We can give thanks for this truly, especially the young ones who are growing up in the truth, because they learn to form a judgment about the evil that is so pronounced in the world, especially Rome. Although God has allowed Communism also to develop, in itself as erroneous as Rome is, only Rome has the field before it and great ability in men to set out evil. God had in Peter a man to denounce error, and we can hardly get anything so strong as this chapter affords us.
LES Would the day dawning and the morning star arising in your hearts be the impregnability of the truth? I am linking it on with the Lord’s word in Thyatira.
JT Just so, the dawn refers to an incoming day, but the morning affords a certain freshness, peculiar freshness - the morning star.
GMW Would a knowledge of the Scriptures preserve us in the truth?
JT Quite so.
GMW Peter refers quite often here to Noah and Lot. I was wondering if that would not connect with the truth because the Scriptures were stressed in the first chapter.
JT And then the extension backwards as Peter alludes to it here, “for whom judgment of old is not idle, and their destruction slumbers not” (verse 3). How far back we cannot just say, but “not idle” is a negative word.
JTJr It speaks of the lake of fire prepared for the devil and his angels.
JT Just so. Another illustration of what we have been saying in the Scriptures, is the lake of fire in the book of Revelation. A lake is striking; it is limited, but yet it is condensed, it carries the idea of condensation. It is [p. 361] condensed so that it should be effective. There is the thousand years too that Peter alludes to; it is striking that God affords Himself latitude, so to speak, as to all these matters: “One day with the Lord is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day”.
JK What is involved in the latter part of verse 2, “through whom the way of the truth shall be blasphemed”, not the truth, but the “way of the truth”. What is set forth in that?
JT The expression “way of the truth” is remarkable.
JTJr We get “the way” in the Acts of the Apostles.
JT Exactly.
JTJr Would that allude also to what we are in today, we are in something, the same things at the present time; the way has come down to us.
Rem Thomas said, “How can we know the way?”, but the Lord Jesus could say, “I am the way”.
JT Just so.
RWS Would a consideration of the way of the truth make our senses more acute as to false prophets and false teachers, because we may become inclined to have too much latitude in our thoughts and be too tolerant of evil doctrine?
JT Maybe you would enlarge on that a little.
RWS I was thinking of the safety of being in the meetings and coming to the meetings, in the way of the truth, so that we should have a proper standard in our minds as to evil and know how to name evil as evil and not be too tolerant as we may be naturally.
JK I was thinking of what you were saying this morning as to moral conditions being worked out in the saints here upon earth. It has pleased divine Persons to work these things out in a concrete way as seen here upon earth. Would that not be involved in the way of the truth as it is seen here in individuals and corporately?
JT What comes to my mind just now is that God has led to the sisters taking their place amongst the [p. 362] saints under certain limitations. And coming together as we are now affords the Spirit of God opportunity to work out things in a conversational way, between the meetings the brethren and the sisters should be occupied with speaking of the truth as it comes out in the meetings, so that it should become practical in our lives and in our observations.
JWW In that light would John’s second epistle to the elect lady bring out the principle in mind?
JT Just so, the elect lady and her children. She had children, so as to say the idea was carried down through children.
JWW She was not to receive into the house those who did not bring certain doctrine. So the way of the truth would stand connected with the profession of things.
JT The devil would work amongst the sisters in an adverse way, adverse to the truth. So the necessity of their observing the truth and defending it, speaking in a general sort of way amongst themselves in defending the truth. They themselves have the armour on ready for defence, defence and attack as well.
LES Would the corruption of all this be seen amongst women in the religious world and in the way they are dealing with what is corrupt in teaching?
JT Just so.
CCT Aquila and Priscilla were able to unfold the way of God. Is that the same thought as the way of truth?
JT They are spoken of equally — husband and wife spoken of equally.
CCT I was thinking of the ministry that you have been giving us recently in regard to the sisters, how they would fall in line with the brothers in this remark as to Aquila and Priscilla, that they would have their responsibility as to being able to unfold the way of the truth.
JT Well now, take a sister like Deborah in the Judges, she would push Barak forward; he rather slackened himself, but she was a peculiar sister in that sense. She says, “Until that I Deborah arose, that I arose a mother in Israel”, Judges 5: 7. She was a mother in Israel, and then several others are mentioned at the same time by her. These are great matters as to sisters and fathers, and sisters seen in relation to fathers.
RWS Since the meeting this morning, I have been thinking over what came before us, and I was wondering if there would be an opportunity in a meeting for care for a sister to prophesy.
JT That is what we spoke of this morning and I do not know how much we have thought of it since.
RWS I was thinking and praying about it and I think many of us were. The care meeting is not exactly an assembly meeting, although it might develop into an assembly meeting; but if it were not an assembly meeting could a sister in a comely way give a word which might bring in the mind of God?
JT I suppose God laid out the necessity for the balance of the truth and that the lead should be with the brothers, masculine. The lead should be masculine, whereas the sisters should follow on according to the power and wisdom they may have and there is so much opportunity amongst them of conversing together in a practical way, supporting what the brothers lead in, because it is quite evident that it is not God’s will to have sisters leading in things, but rather taking part in aiding and supporting what the brothers, the masculine side, would advocate, because God evidently has set the man first. “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; and let them have dominion”, Genesis 1: 26. The word “them” includes the feminine, but they have dominion, they have dominion together.
JTJr In Acts 18: 26, where Aquila and Priscilla are referred to, he is mentioned first. It says, “And Aquila and Priscilla, having heard him, took him to them and unfolded to him the way of God more exactly”. That is the lead is in the man, but both of them evidently were in the [p. 364] instruction.
JT Just so. They took him to them, that would be Apollos.
LES Would not the word of a prophetess furnish support in the working out of the truth?
JT Well I think it will if the sisters do their part comely and in a seemly way; they will have great power in confirming what the brothers lead in, because we should be with God in everything, and God has ordered it that the man should be first, but at the same time the woman is from Man (Genesis 2: 22). It is a remarkable thing that God ordered that for us. We have to learn something from it.
LES Is it not suggestive that the first part of the section you referred to this morning brings in the sisters and the last part refers to the sisters. I mean in 1 Corinthians 11 and 14?
JT But the strong word is, “I do not suffer a woman to teach nor to exercise authority over man” (1 Timothy 2: 12); that is very striking. But at the same time it is offset so that the sisters do their part in a comely, seemly and sisterly manner.
LES Would it imply anything in that it is not said, ‘I suffer not a woman to prophesy’. Paul does not refer to prophecy, but he refers to teaching.
JT What we were saying as to those two chapters in 1 Corinthians will need more attention than we have been able to give.
TLS In Exodus 15, “Miriam the prophetess, the sister of Aaron, took the tambour in her hand, and all the women went out after her with tambours and with dances. And Miriam answered them, Sing to Jehovah, for he is highly exalted: the horse and his rider hath he thrown into the sea”. She just said what Moses had said before.
JT She is a sister of Moses of course and of Aaron, and gave way to feminine weakness too in attacking Moses, which is a remarkable thing. We are not to forget that; a certain tendency to rivalry, I would [p. 365] say, in which Aaron and Miriam had part. All that is just to be thought of in our meditations on this whole matter in 1 Corinthians 11 and 14.
GMW Would you define the meaning of prophesying?
JT Well there is something very peculiar in it. I am not ready to undertake to define it. It is something that begins with God. We have false prophets here.
JK I believe you have said that Mary in John 20 had a definite word from the Lord to bring to the disciples, but the woman in 2 Kings 4 was rather out of her place, even though in the house, so that death was found working in the house. Is that right?
JT Quite so. Perhaps you will point out the actual details so we would know a little better what you mean.
JK I was just thinking that in John 20 Mary brings a definite word from the Lord to the disciples and they accept it, whereas in 2 Kings 4 the woman seems to take the initiative; death is working and when death comes in she says, “All is well”. Then she goes to the prophet, and she also says to the prophet that all is well. But nevertheless death is there. So when the prophet is brought into it, does he not have to walk to and fro in the house to see what is wrong?
JT That is right. Something possibly in the way of newspapers and other things like that which would bring in leaven which would be poisonous. So Elisha had to look after that; he had to attend to it and he did attend to it. He is the man of grace, you know.
JK I think you pointed out very helpfully that he brings in grace, but nevertheless when death is working it is exposed, is it not?
JT Yes it is, that is quite right. Now what would you say as to overcoming that?
JK I think what you have been bringing before us today is helpful in that way that there is that which is being found morally amongst the saints which is able to deal with it. Is that [p. 366] not so?
JT Just so.
ASB With regard to your reference to Roman Catholicism, and our scripture here as to false prophets and false teachers, the falsification of the truth and the bringing in of destructive heresies, it says, “and deny the master that bought them”. The work of redemption is involved in it and our Lord Jesus is set aside by a vicar on earth which is the masculine side; it is falsifying the truth. And now in our day they have brought something forward in an extreme way falsifying the truth concerning the mother of our Lord, blessed as she is, but exalting a woman to be, in a certain sense, commensurate with divine Persons.
JT And it is remarkable that the Lord Himself speaks of Mary, His own mother, and calls her woman. He says, “What have I to do with thee, woman?”, John 2: 4. These persons who advocate Mary would do well to think of that. I have thought of it a good deal. There are about ten women spoken of in the gospel of John that might be well considered as to all these matters.
Rem I was thinking that the end of Matthew 12 would fortify the brethren, because it says there, “But while he was yet speaking to the crowds, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, seeking: to speak to him. Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren are standing without, seeking to speak to thee. But he answering said to him that spoke to him, Who is my mother, and who are my brethren? And, stretching out his hand to his disciples, he said, Behold my mother and my brethren; for whosoever shall do the will of my Father who is in the heavens, he is my brother, and sister, and mother”.
JT Quite so. That brings in a very good line of thought and I am glad you mentioned it. The person who told the Lord His mother was waiting for Him outside was not spiritual at all. He should not have said that. He should have had more respect for the Lord than to say that. And that reminds us how we should have [p. 367] respect for divine things and have respect for anything that refers to the Lord Himself.
ASCSr The last verse of the previous chapter indicates that holy men of God spake under the power of the Holy Spirit. The absence of that in much that is recorded in chapter 2 would indicate to our hearts the need of being spiritually sensitive to what is in the power of the Spirit.
JT Quite so. The Spirit of God being here is the great point that is stressed constantly, because He is sent from heaven, and He has taken a lowly place, a wonderful lowly place all these centuries.
Ques Should not the matter of sisters speaking have a great place with them? It was when Elizabeth was filled with the Spirit that she began to speak. Should we look for that among the sisters that they speak spontaneously under the direction of the Spirit?
JT just so.
TU In connection with the sisters prophesying, and your remark as to the propriety of making room for what is masculine, I wondered about the four daughters of Philip who had ability to prophesy, whether the comeliness of these sisters is seen in making room for the prophet, the man, Agabus.
JT Just so. What we began with in this chapter should be followed up a little more. There were false prophets also among the people. They would find opportunity no doubt among the people, there being no protection against error in that sense. We should note in verses 1 to 10, expressed in Peter’s wonderful language, the respect that he has for the Lord, his Master, and the way in which he stresses lordship, for God would maintain that thought and principle of authority and dignity amongst the brethren. Peter also draws attention to the agencies that were operating and using what was false — well-turned words.
JTJr I think if anything defective is apt to be amongst us — anything brought in that is defective — [p. 368] it should be condemned immediately as it is going to affect the fellowship.
JT Quite so, condemn it immediately. And now the question comes in as to how sisters, although they are not brought in here, can prophesy in mingling together in a holy way with others, so that a thing is confirmed. It is set out in a way to commend it in a very orderly sense, in a seemly way by sisters.
JMcK I was thinking of Hymenaeus and Alexander, Paul says as to them, “have made shipwreck as to faith; of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I have delivered to Satan, that they may be taught by discipline not to blaspheme”, 1 Timothy 1: 19, 20. I was thinking, in view of the remarks that have been made, that anything that is not according to the truth should be taken up and judged. Sometimes we think of small matters, so that Paul here speaks of the matter of shipwreck as to the faith and he connects it with blasphemy.
JT And it is to be dealt with immediately, as was remarked.
JMcK I was thinking of the connection, in the chapter we are reading, between the way of faith and those who blasphemed the way of the truth.
JTJr I notice that sentence runs from verse 4 to the middle of verse 10, a very long sentence, perhaps one of the longest, very extraordinary really in regard to the grammatical working of it, and yet it is all connected.
JT Very good. And then in verse 10: “Bold are they”, he comes back to that, “self-willed; they do not fear speaking injuriously of dignities”. I think the idea of dignity is very important, that is the dignity that belongs to those who are on God’s side in the truth.
CCT It should be a great encouragement to us this afternoon, in view of all the untruth that is going through the scene at the present time, that the Lord knows. Would that be an encouragement to us to stand for [p. 369] the truth?
JT Just so. The Lord knows those that are His.
CCT I was not thinking of that so much. That is true, but I was thinking of verse 9, “The Lord knows how to deliver the godly out of trial”.
ASCSr In Acts 16 Paul and others having come to Philippi, moved out by the river where it was customary for prayer to be and they spoke with the women assembled. Is there an encouraging thought that there was such a state there among the sisters that Paul could delight to converse with them?
JT And there was a certain one whose heart the Lord opened to attend to the things spoken by Paul.
Rem In chapter 1, verse 12 it says, “Wherefore I will be careful to put you always in mind of these things”, and then in verse 13, “But I account it right, as long as I am in this tabernacle, to stir you up by putting you in remembrance”, and then in verse 15, “But I will use diligence, that after my departure ye should have also, at any time, in your power to call to mind these things”. He would fortify them against the evil about to come in?
JT Quite so, and that after he was put to death.
WMcK Are the other references in this chapter to fortify us in our souls? The way of truth has been referred to, the apostle also refers in verse 15 to the straight way, and then in verse 21 to the way of righteousness.
JT Very good. I think we are profiting by what we are saying, these readings afford special help, and then the conversation that occurs between the meetings carries on what is said in the meetings. In the meetings when we are convened the Spirit of God has peculiar power, but in the interim, although we are not so particular so to speak, there would be something for good in the conversation that transpires.
Rem Reference was made to the woman of worth in Proverbs. It says of her, “She surveyeth the ways of her household”.
JT Very good. “She surveyeth the ways of her household”. The children ought to be under her control.
CAM Would it not be a practical matter to realise that when Noah was preserved, his wife was preserved and the wives of his three sons? The feminine was preserved in that way; whereas with Lot the feminine was disastrous; I mean the outcome of it, on account of the terrible wickedness of the world.
GMW If a sister is prophesying, bringing the mind of God to bear for the moment, that would not of necessity have to be in the assembly, would it?
JT No, not necessarily, we can talk of it at any time, if it is right to do so.
GMW So if, in conversation, a sister brings the word of God to bear upon my soul if I had done something wrong, that would be a prophetic word to me.
JT Surely, where are sisters to prophesy if they do not do it on those lines? We cannot have it in the assembly, so they must do it somewhere, and the households of the saints would be the best place to do it. We are counting on God to give sobriety in all that is said and done.
JTJr Sarah’s words in her house became scripture, did they not?
JT Quite so.
JTJr “Cast out this handmaid and her son”, Genesis 21: 10.
JH So are we to make a difference between that which Paul speaks of in assembly and the thought as to Mary bringing word to the disciples?
JT What do you want to say about that?
JH Well, I was thinking about the distinction between the two occasions. “Comes bringing word to the disciples”, would be informal, you might say.
JT Quite so.
JH But the word ‘in assembly’ is on a higher level, is it [p. 371] not?
JT We must not forget the word “Rabboni”. That became current amongst the saints, I am sure, — that is Teacher.
Rem In regard to sisters prophesying, what you were bringing before us from 1 Corinthians 11 seems to be important; you stated it was not so much emphasizing the idea of prophesying, but the idea of covering. I feel how needful this is. We would feel we cannot expect them to prophesy if they do not accept the matter of covering. These matters should be accepted among the sisters.
JT That is very good. Just let us observe whether sisters are covered when they should be. Some are not, they pay no attention to it whatsoever, and therefore it should be noticed and spoken of because it is a public matter that the sisters should be covered when they should be covered, and we should be able to speak of it properly.
MO Would the fact that Philip had four virgin daughters that prophesied link more with the household than with the assembly?
JT Very good. It would be the household; there were four of them.
MO They would not be his daughters in the assembly, would they?
JT No, they would be sisters. But they prophesied, they were prophetesses. Of course they are very rare now, a prophetess is very rare, not that I would despise the sisters in any sense, but it is quite rare to find anyone who prophesies.
ASB Would Rhoda, the young sister in Acts 12, be in principle carrying out the service of prophecy?
JT Quite so, she stood by the truth, she suffered for the truth; she maintained that it was really Peter who was there.
ASB She recognized the voice of Peter. The answer to prayer in principle would be a voice of a divine [p. 372] Person and she reported that the apostle was there. They said, Thou art mad, but she stood by the truth.
JT Very good.
CCT How does Phoebe come into the matter? she was a minister of the assembly, a deaconess.
JT Whatever was right to be done, she would do in a right and comely way. She was comely in what she was doing. It is remarkable that these cases have come up for us because they help us at the present time in view of all that has arisen in regard to sisters. It is only about eighteen months ago when the question arose in Bristol, I think it was, that the sisters should be present at all the meetings, not just brothers only.
JK Deborah arose and went with Barak, so that in that way Barak took the initiative in one sense.
JT But it says she arose herself, that is to say it was her doing. God was in it of course, but it was her doing. “Until ... I arose a mother in Israel”, Judges 5: 7. She took that distinction herself, and God supported her in it.
JK Yes. What she says is, “I will by all means go with thee, only that it will not be to thine honour upon the way which thou goest, for Jehovah will sell Sisera into the hand of a woman”. Then it says, “And Deborah arose, and went with Barak to Kedesh”, Judges 4: 9. So that she moved with him.
JT I should say all these facts are very important and we can see how important they are in the way they are coming before us at this present time in Indianapolis.
TU Have you any thought as to the service of the sisters in connection with Apollos? Aquila and Priscilla unfolded to him the way of God more exactly. I was thinking of the sisters in the idea of teaching. He knew only the baptism of John, but now that he had been taught he could announce publicly that Jesus was the [p. 373] Christ.
JT Well she and her husband took him to them. Is that what you have in mind?
TU I was thinking Priscilla had her part in that matter. Earlier it says, “He spoke and taught”, and later on it says, “He with great force convinced the Jews publicly, shewing by the scriptures that Jesus was the Christ”, Acts 18: 28.
JT What a valuable man he was — Apollos!
MO Does not Deborah add a seemly note to her song when she says, “My heart is toward the governors of Israel”?
JT Just so.
Ques Would not Hannah be an example for good for our sisters, the comely way in which she answered?
JT Quite so. She suffered too. When you get suffering as with Rhoda and Hannah then you may be sure that God is peculiarly in it.
Rem Eli observed her lips moving; she was not speaking audibly.
JT Quite so.
WHC Are the sisters included in the matter of casting lots in Acts 1: 26? It says, “And they appointed two, Joseph, who was called Barsabas, who had been surnamed Justus, and Matthias. And they prayed, and said, Thou Lord, knower of the hearts of all, shew which one of these two thou hast chosen, to receive the lot of this service and apostleship, from which Judas transgressing fell to go to his own place. And they gave lots ...” That is what I have in mind. Are the sisters in that matter?
JT Well, God had recognized that both in the Old and in the New Testament. We do not do it now, because we do not have to, we have the Holy Spirit amongst us and He makes up for everything if we make way for Him. We do not need anything more in that sense if we make way for the Spirit.
Ques Would casting lots be the same as voting today?
JT You said voting; did you mean ordinary [p. 374] voting?
Rem Yes.
JT That is a political idea and I therefore would not use it much; only the idea is there. I would be ashamed to use the word among the Lord’s people, such as, I vote for him. I would be ashamed to use it or do it.
Ques Would not verse 14 of chapter 1 of Acts indicate that the women were there?
JT Clearly they were, of course they were, and they have been here so to speak ever since — they are here today. And they come to the care meetings in London and in New York too.
Rem In Minneapolis too.
JT Very good. The truth is making its way therefore.
Rem They were there giving sanction to what was going on.
JT We have however to say this, that when the Lord instituted the Supper, the sisters do not seem to have been there. He sat down with the twelve. It is only to be mentioned; that is all that is needed.
CAM But before the house was prepared for the incoming of the Spirit, they were there then, were they not? I mean to say the Holy Spirit came to indwell the house when the sisters were there. I am only drawing a distinction between the Supper, when the Lord just had the brothers, and the time when the Spirit came; I take it that there were sisters present to make up the material for the house.
JT Quite so. Have you anything more to say about that?
CAM I just wondered whether it would be right to feel that that matter of the brothers in connection with the Supper was prior to the coming of the Spirit. That is all I meant, that the thing was complete really when the Spirit came.
JT Quite so. The coming of the Spirit settles everything. He has taken a lowly place and was sent from heaven, and that settles everything. “He abides [p. 375] with you, and shall be in you” (John 14: 17), as He is this very day amongst us here.
JK Does not the first verse in Romans 16 show the great place a sister can have, “But I commend to you Phoebe, our sister, who is minister of the assembly which is in Cenchrea”. Minister of the assembly.
JT You will have to decide how she ministered; she must have done things which could be done by a sister, clearly.
JK So that she had a great place in that sense, did she not?
JT Quite so. She is a remarkable woman; one has often spoken of her.
MO If it is not diverting would you say a word on Acts 2: 4: “And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and began to speak with other tongues as the Spirit gave to them to speak forth”? Would you include the sisters in it?
JT I think so, in regard of what is before us now.
JTJr Does it not say, “Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy”?
JT Quite so.
TLS Just how do you view the daughters of Zelophehad?
JT What I would say especially about them is they spoke right; it was a great matter.
TLS It says of them, “And they stood before Moses, and before Eleazar the priest, and before the princes and the whole assembly, at the entrance of the tent of meeting, saying ...”. The evidence is they spoke, saying such and such a thing; they were in the proper position.
JT We cannot apply the Old Testament to the assembly, it is not a guide for that, you know. The New Testament is the New Testament and there is no equal.
ASC I am encouraged in relation to Anna — what characterized her in her service. She was waiting with [p. 376] prayer and fasting on the coming of the blessed Lord, a thing of great value for us to know something about, the sisters having a special part; it says of Simeon that the Holy Spirit was upon him, but the sister was characterized by fasting and prayer, so that she was able to speak to those in Jerusalem of the coming of this blessed Person.
JT Very good. Would the brethren now be kind enough to let us go on with the chapter because it is a most weighty chapter? Notice the comparison Peter makes between persons, and how he brings it to bear upon the truth.
Ques That is like Jude, is it not? — “Spots in your love-feasts”.
JT Just so.
RWS I wanted to ask about the way the Spirit of God speaks about Lot, as a righteous man, “righteous Lot”. I was wondering why, under these circumstances with this Old Testament history, the Spirit of God is speaking that way.
JT I think Peter is gracious, you know; he gives latitude, speaks in a gracious way about these persons. Why should we not use all the grace possible that we are entitled to use? I think Peter is governed by grace in all he is saying here.
RWS Would it fit in with the next chapter in which we have God’s unwillingness that any should perish?
JT Quite so.
TLS I would like to ask about verse four of our chapter, “God spared not the angels who had sinned”. I was wondering if that would be a kind of lesson to us in the matter of dealing with sin, no personal preferences.
JT Just so.
TLS God spared not the angels, it was His own creation.
JT The question of angels has often been mentioned, but it is mysterious; you cannot say too much because you might be in error. At the same time I remember in Auckland, New Zealand, we had a meeting [p. 377] on miracles, and it was pointed out that you cannot be too sure. We know when man was created, but we cannot tell when angels were created, nor how many there were. So that we have to be careful in speaking about angels. “Are they not all ministering spirits, sent out for service on account of those who shall inherit salvation?”, Hebrews 1: 14. That gives you the light I think that we have in speaking of angels. We cannot be too sure as to them except what Scripture says of them.
BI Reference was made to the sisters being present on the day of Pentecost. They were speaking with tongues. The apostle says, “Greater is he that prophesies than he that speaks with tongues”.
J.T. What is your point?
BI We were speaking about the part the sisters might have in prophesying; we have no record of sisters prophesying in the assembly, but they were there when they were speaking with tongues.
JT Quite right.
MO Would it be right to say that in this chapter evil is dealt with summarily, whereas in chapter one it is more the saints having power to extricate themselves from it?
JT Quite. And then Peter speaks of sin, not apostasy but sin.
JWW Would Noah stand out in the midst of these evil conditions; he was a preacher of righteousness?
JT More honoured than any of them you might say at that time, a preacher of righteousness.
JTJr Unestablished souls (see verse 14), that is those not founded in the truth, may be easily allured and upset.
JT Then this word, children of curse, is a terrible thing. Notice the strength of Peter’s remarks here, “Children of curse; having left the straight way they have gone astray, having followed in the path of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the reward of unrighteousness; but had reproof of his own wickedness — the dumb ass speaking with man’s voice forbad the folly of the prophet”. These are remarkable words, I am struck with them and the power of Peter’s speech here.
CCT “These are springs without water”. Just the opposite from what we understand as coming to us through the Spirit, there would be the flowing forth with freshness, but here it is springs without water. There is no freshness in the thought at all, is there?
JT Christians have water; that is what I pointed out this morning; we need water at these meetings.
CCT That is right, the idea of springing up.
JT Springing up unto everlasting life.