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THE REVELATION OF GOD IN LUKE AND IN JOHN

JT The subject is rather a large one, but I thought we might touch it very briefly. The scriptures read should help as to the distinction which has to be made between the revelation of God as presented in Luke and as presented in John. Luke presents the compassion side, the compassion of God; John, the love of God. I was connecting it in my mind with the “appearance of a man” presented in Ezekiel on the throne, and the expressions “from the appearance of his loins even downward” and “from the appearance of his loins even upward”. (Ezekiel 1:26,27). We might see in Luke the thought of the man “from the appearance of his loins even downward”, and in John “from the appearance of his loins even upward”. Love is connected with the counsels of God, but we see the form which the love takes in relieving you and me in the way of compassion “from the appearance of the loins even downward”. Perhaps Romans might be taken to correspond with the loins downward, and Ephesians with the loins upward, the great love of God in connection with His counsels.

RD You have taken up two scriptures speaking of the raising of the dead?

JT The widow of Nain is not said to be loved by the Lord; it is not said that He knew her before. It was entirely a question of compassion for her, the Lord taking account of her need, whereas in John the Lord knew the persons concerned, those who were affected, and it says He loved each of them. Death being the most powerful means of affecting the human race, it becomes in that way an occasion of meeting its effects, of God showing consideration either in the way of compassion or in the way of ^[p. 470] love.

RD In John, the Lord having set His heart on each one of those mentioned, there is the purpose of God in view?

JT I think so. We have to take account of death as affecting the family of God, which is loved by the Lord and already known to Him. Jordan was the great barrier between the wilderness and the land; it would correspond with John 11 in that way.

WL You would look on death not only as the penalty of sin, but as the expression of the love of God?

JT It was in the death of Christ that the love of God was expressed. I think Romans presents the death of Christ from the compassion side, and Ephesians from the love side. The compassion side is wider because it takes in the whole race, humanity is in view.

RD The last scripture has the family of God in view?

JT Yes, and the accomplishment of His counsels in the family.

ET Luke brings out the side of grace?

JT That is what I had in mind, and I hoped it might move us a little as to the gospel. It may be those who are specially privileged may limit themselves a little too much to the family side, and lose sight of the compassion side.

RD I am glad you speak of that, because it is a present exercise. The Lord is engaged at the present moment in both these ways.

JT I am sure He is. He is engaged in the gospel: I am sure of it; the compassions of the Lord are toward all. He had compassion on the widow; it does not say that He loved her.

Ques Would you say God loves the world?

JT Well; it is put in the past tense, “God so loved”. (John 3:16). I should not like to put it in the present, because the world is exposed. It has shown its hand ^[p. 471] as opposed to God and to Christ; but that was how it stood then.

ETS There is still compassion for anyone in the world.

JT Yes, certainly. It is answered by that word in Romans 3:22, “towards all”. Then in chapter 5:8 you have, “God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us”. It does not say He commends His love toward man. In Titus it speaks of the kindness and love of God, but that is more the idea of philanthropy.

WL When God gave His only begotten Son, the world disclosed itself as hostile to God, but the magnificent proof of His love still stands.

JT Yes, but you must not go beyond Scripture.

JP “Whosoever believeth”; that is present.

JT Just so; that I am sure is important. One has very little difficulty about anyone speaking of the love of God to the world, but it is well to be accurate, and Scripture is infinitely accurate. I suppose the reference is to the world as it then existed, and this in the abstract will come about in the future. The world had not disclosed itself then as hostile to God and to Christ. I suppose you can always draw attention to what God has done.

RD You have to follow that on to get the benefit of it: “He gave”, “that whosoever”.

JT The force of “whosoever” there is that it applies to the Gentile as well as to the Jew. John’s writings discredit the claims of the Jew. The love of God is spoken of in Romans, but when it comes to beseeching, the apostle beseeches by the compassions of God. The general thought in Romans is compassion.

Ques Is not His love behind the compassion?

JT Yes, surely. So I have referred to Ezekiel because it is God in a Man, and the prophet saw the appearance of fire from the loins upward and from ^[p. 472] the loins downward. If God is to act judicially, it is wholly in keeping with His love. In Revelation you see the Lord girt about with a golden girdle; the love is pent up, but it is there. God is love; and whether it takes the form of compassion or of direct affection, it is love. Love is what He is.

WL Would you not say that God was love before there was any need?

JT Yes. In Ephesians it is that we might be holy and without blame before Him in love; that to my mind is connected with “the loins upward”. It was on account of His great love wherewith He loved us. He acts toward us in that way because of His great love; it is not exactly taking compassion on us, but it is because of His great love. 1 Timothy 2:3,4 says, that supplications and prayers should be made for all men, and then it goes on to say, “God our Saviour: who will have all men to be saved”.

RD The scripture you are calling attention to in Timothy presents the world just as it is; “kings, and for all that are in authority”, (1 Timothy 2:2) and your outlook is in regard to the gospel, God’s thoughts for men generally.

JT Yes, and I think we need to be reminded of the fact that atheism is brought in by the enemy to meet the great awakening. There is great poverty as to the preaching side of the word; there is very little public gospel testimony now. Those whom the Lord may have used in the past have passed off the scene, and they are not followed up by others. There seems a great dearth of gospel testimony in the world.

F.W.B. Why is that?

JT I am rather afraid that those who are privileged to have light from God have been too circumscribed.

RD It is quite possible that we lack compassion. We need to come under the hand of the Lord as He is ^[p. 473] presented here to have our souls filled with His feelings towards men generally.

JT That is exactly the exercise I have; that we might be able to have compassion for men as they are, in all their circumstances. I think Romans, if rightly understood, would move us to take account of all men. There is a great movement among men for spiritual satisfaction. There is very little today to oppose atheism. The influence of God is recognised in the spiritual world, but the enemy is making use of it to bring in the grossest error.

RD Paul’s spirit was stirred within him when he saw what was going on at Athens. The moral beauty of the incident in Luke 7 is that the compassions are fully adequate to the need.

JT In Luke, when the Lord calls the apostles, He first prays the whole night. He names the apostles, then He descends with them to the plain. They get down to the level of men. Being up with the Lord in the mount, you come on to the plain with Him. I think Paul beautifully illustrates it, because he is on the plain with men. He identifies himself with them: “For in him we live, and move and have our being;” (Acts 17:28). He is on the same level as they are.

ETS Do not evangelists sometimes develop into teachers?

JT Young brothers find in preaching an outlet for spiritual energy that they could not find otherwise.

WL We are sometimes apt to think that the end of the dispensation is so near that the gospel day is over.

RD I am thankful for these exercises; it is desirable that there should be a distinct testimony in the gospel before we go.

JT “And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely”. (Revelation 22:17). That seems particularly applicable today.

^[p. 474] Ques Have you any thought that there should be a going out into the highways and by-ways?

JT I think so, if we are sufficiently humble about it. Ezekiel helps us in that respect. These are humiliating days: it is a day of captivity outwardly. God has allowed the world to captivate the church; if there is to be recovery, it must be on individual lines. Ezekiel tells us that he sat among the captives.

PSP It was when the house of Israel showed themselves to be humbled and ashamed of all that they had done, that the prophet could show them the form of the house and the outgoings thereof, as well as the comings in thereof.

JT Quite so.

RD Do you not think that the compassions and the opportunity meet? If we were moved with compassion, there would be an open door for us. When the servant came back he said, “Yet there is room”.

Ques In the revelation of God, you would include the gospel as set forth in John as well as in Luke?

JT Yes, but Luke runs alongside of the assembly testimony. The breakdown had not occurred. The ministry of the gospel is Luke and Romans, the ministry of the assembly Colossians and Ephesians.

RD Paul pursued his service until the saints came into the good of the “loins upward”.

Ques Do brothers drop the gospel as they get older, or do they present it in a different way, as knowing it perhaps a little better?

JT Well, Paul did not drop it. He says, “that by me the preaching might be fully known”. (2 Timothy 4:17). He dwelt two whole years in his own hired house, preaching the kingdom of God. No doubt the more developed he was, the more fully he could present it.

FWB Do you connect the gospel more with the grace of God than with the love of God?

JT Yes, ^[p. 475] I do.

FWB What do you understand by the gospel of the grace of God?

JT Grace is God acting from Himself, adapting Himself to human need. The two ministries should go together. God would not tell anyone to preach unless he was qualified. Anyone with the gift of an evangelist would be instructed by the Lord before he was sent out to preach. They were taken up to be with Him; as with Him,. He would instruct them as to what was in His mind,

JP The Lord had compassion on the widow. I thought it was on the line of Psalm 72:12 “The poor also, and him that hath no helper”. It is the blessed Man who is in authority.

JT It does not follow that because a man has the gift of an evangelist, he has not another.

Ques What would answer to the city in Luke 7:11?

JT The world systematised, the world beautified. All that the world can do is to turn out the dead body of a man.

Ques Would you encourage young believers as soon as they are converted to begin to preach?

JT I would not. A man has to be sent from God to preach. The principle is set out in Acts 11. Barnabas went to Tarsus to seek Saul, and when he had found him he brought him to Antioch: he was at Antioch a whole year, going in and out among the saints. The preachers are first of all well-known in their locality. A preacher needs to be qualified, and to have the fellowship of his brethren. He should have the opportunity of moving among his brethren and getting acquainted with them. The Lord would first of all instruct us as to what is in His mind. The Lord had wrought at Antioch before Paul and Barnabas went there, and had provided what was requisite for the assembly. In undertaking any work that seems to have a public bearing, we ^[p. 476] ought to make it clear that we are humble about the position. If we turn to the Lord in recognition of the need, He would make opportunities and give power to meet the need.

RD We see in John that God is love, also that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world.

JT Yes. In Isaiah 6:8 there was the need of a messenger. “Whom shall I send, and who will go for us?” The Lord is on the throne: there is no lack in that way, there is power for any ministry. Am I prepared to take up a service of that kind? One should have the confidence of his brethren in what he is doing. Gift is not local: it is for the whole assembly. God has set certain “in the assembly”. (1 Corinthians 12:28). The thought of a local gift would add something to our locality. In Luke 4:43, the Lord preached at Nazareth where He had been brought up, but He says, “I must preach the kingdom of God to other cities also”.

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