THE EXPANSE (5)

THE EXPANSE (5)

Ephesians 1: 9 - 23; Ephesians 3: 8 - 21

SMcC It is fitting that we should close the brief search we have sought to make together in regard to the subject of the expanse with what we have in this epistle, and especially what comes before us in the sections that we have read from it. We have only, as it were, touched the fringe of the subject, for it is a vast subject in the Scriptures. When we come to Ephesians, we are impressed with the fulness of God’s thoughts that are now reached in the assembly in its relations with Christ, in the expanse as designed and made by God, having in mind His operations. And while they are wonderful in relation to the physical side of creation, how much more wonderful they are in relation to the spiritual and heavenly side, which is now to engage us. We cannot dwell on all the details of the sections that we have read, since they are very full, but it is particularly in mind in the first section to consider how the assembly, as the body of Christ, is linked with Him in the headship, in the wonderful influence which will affect the whole universe; for in the heavenly position, the assembly will affect every part of the universe and every family in it. We know that Christ’s influence operates through the assembly and it should leave an impression, a fresh touch on our spirits and souls, as we see the uniqueness of the setting in Ephesians 1. It is not what we have in Colossians, where Christ is “the head of the body, the assembly,” but His headship here is to the assembly, which carries its unique distinctiveness, as bearing upon the universe bearing upon it in the way of influence and rule and administration. Then, in the last passage, it is in mind to see the assembly’s great place, and what a subject of interest it is to the principalities and authorities in the heavenlies. We have this marvellous vessel that is so near to Christ, no company ever could be as near to Christ as the assembly. Israel, however exalted God’s thoughts are in regard to Israel, never has the place as the body of Christ, and does not know the intimacy that the assembly knows in that relation. And the principalities and authorities, all having their place in the expanse, are greatly interested in this vessel of vessels, in which there is made known the all-various wisdom of God, culminating, as the chapter works out in the features of divine operations that are projected on to view in the great thought of such fulness and result, “to him be glory in the assembly in Christ Jesus unto all generations of the age of ages. Amen.” We have often gone over and read and re-read these passages, but as we are subject to one another, and the Holy Spirit is free amongst us, we may get some fresh impression of the assembly’s greatness as linked with Christ in all His greatness as Man, in this section. The full work of God is in mind; that is, the full thought of the expanse and divine operations in it being reached, we might say, in this letter, in these relations viewed between Christ and the assembly, and standing as they do in relation to the universe.

LWT Is God’s great triumph in the expanse seen by the things in the heavens and the things upon the earth being together headed up in the Christ? And does the assembly have a great part in that?

SMcC It does. The casting of Satan out of the expanse makes way for the holy city, in its relations with Christ, to fill the scene, without any let or hindrance to divine operations in relation to this great thought of heading up. The thought of the city is a co-relative thought to what we have here, only it is John’s way of speaking of it. The city does not convey quite the thought of intimacy and nearness that the body does, but it does convey intimacy and nearness in another light.

CMM Would you connect the expression “the heavenlies,” so peculiar to this epistle, with the thought of the expanse?

SMcC That is what is in one’s mind, that the fulness in relation to divine operations in the expanse is reached in relation to the assembly in connection with the thought of the heavenlies, in this letter. We do not get any reference in Scripture to ‘the fulness of the heavens,’ or ‘the fulness of the expanse’; we do get it in relation to the earth, “The earth is Jehovah’s, and the fulness thereof,” Psalm 24: 1. But this chapter suggests the full result of God’s operations, the full end reached in connection with His work, in the position of the saints in the heavenlies.

FAB Would you please tell us the difference between head of the assembly and head to the assembly?

SMcC In Colossians, where Christ is said to be the head of the body, the assembly is under His headship, but in Ephesians 1, she is not under His headship, she is with Him in the headship.

JMcK Would it be something like the body getting the gain of His headship in Colossians, but the body being instrumental in that headship affecting the universe in Ephesians?

SMcC That is the point. She is associated with Him in the headship. It is just like the husband and the wife in relation to the family; the wife is associated with the husband in the headship. If the husband goes away, the great thought of the headship is worked out through the wife in relation to the family. That is the Ephesian thought and that is how the thought will stand in relation to the universe. The universe does not get the direct impulses of Christ; the universe gets the impulses of Christ and the guidance and direction of Christ indirectly through the assembly,

the body of Christ, which receives them directly.

JMcK Is it interesting that in Revelation 21, as soon as you have the bride adorned for her husband, you have the word “the tabernacle of God is with men”? Would that be the same principle working out, the impulses would be through Christ and the bride, the assembly?

SMcC Exactly. That is John’s way of putting it. It corresponds with what we have in Paul’s ministry here, that the tabernacle is the medium of contact with the universe. The assembly is so great in her formation that she becomes the great medium of contact with all the families that are embodied in the thought of men in that section.

RGB Is it your thought that the shedding forth of the influence of Christ through the assembly in that way, involves a peculiar delicacy and intimacy in her relations with Christ?

SMcC Exactly. It is a wonderful thing, when you take account of it, that there is this thought of the body as it is seen in Ephesians 1. While from one aspect, we have got two personalities in Christ and the assembly, from another aspect they are one. Union involves that they are one. So that it is not just a representation of the influence of Christ or the direction of Christ, it is the influence of Christ actually working out through the assembly, because they are one in relation to the thought of union.

JMcK Does what you are saying stress the importance of the assembly, His body, His fulness?

SMcC It does. That is, the bearing of it in that passage, as you would know, is towards the universe. In Christ we have the fulness of the Godhead in Colossians, but the assembly is the fulness of Christ towards the universe. That is, anything that is to be known of Christ in the universe is known through the assembly, it comes out through the assembly.

ST In Proverbs 31, as to the woman of worth, it says, “many daughters have done worthily, but thou excellent them all,” Is that in relation to the influence of Christ?

SMcC Yes, that passage and other passages in the Old Testament bring it up in type and foreshadowing, as we also have in Psalm 45, “the queen in gold of Ophir”; she is associated with Him in rule.

AJG Is it not a wonderful expression of divine wisdom and grace that God puts Himself in touch with the universe through a vessel which is herself a creature vessel, through Christ and the assembly, the assembly being united to Him?

SMcC That is a marvellous thing, and that we should be part of that creature vessel is what is so affecting. It is a creature vessel in its make-up and capacity, yet holding things and standing related to things that are beyond creature capacity. God putting Himself in touch with men, through it, eternally. In the millennial world, the nations and Israel, the whole universe, will be affected by what works out through the assembly.

LWT Would it be right to say that that influence of Christ is in no way diminished by reason of the creature vessel?

SMcC Not in any sense. That is the wonder of it all. In the expanse that is laid out in Genesis 1, we have the matter set out in principle, set out basically in Genesis 1, but what must it be to the heart of God, as we reach Ephesians and see what is reached in the full result of His own operations in the assembly in relation to the expanse! There is a vessel in it in heavenly status equal to Christ, speaking reverently, as Man, alongside of Him, through which divine impulses can reach the universe.

AJG In the typical presentation of this in Genesis 2, we have the man as head of a great system, have we not, comprising heavenly and earthly; and then we have the woman brought to him, and she is his counterpart, his like, to be with him in the headship?

SMcC So that Genesis 2, in type, is really necessary as the counterpart of Genesis 1 to give us what we have here in that way, I mean by that, that in the sun and the moon and the stars, you do not have the thought of love or affection operating; they are bodies of rule and influence in the universe, and certain heat and other things are generated through their influence, but we do not have the thought of affection and love. But when we come into the realm in Genesis 2, where the fulness of things works out in relation to the man and the woman in the garden, you get two beings, in whom there is affection for one another, reciprocal affection; as the man stands in admiration of the woman and the woman stands in admiration of the man. It is necessary, in the type, according to what we have in Ephesians.

AWGT In that connection, could you say something about the expression, “This time it is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh: this shall be called Woman, because this was taken out of a man,” Genesis 2: 23?

SMcC That is bearing on what we are speaking of in regard to the body; that is, the body is out of Christ. There are two thoughts, as we know, involved in Ephesians; there is the organic side in the body, and union in Scripture is not exactly linked with the organic side, union is linked more with the two beings that we have referred to, the man and the woman; the woman builded by God and brought to the man.

RW Would you say that chapter 4 of the epistle to the Ephesians starts at the top? In Solomon’s temple, the two pillars had the lily-work upon the top; 1 Kings 7: 22.

SMcC Yes, we are impressed with ornamentation in regard to the system of things in Solomon. God sets out His great thoughts and then He indicates the means by which we arrive at them.

CRB Could we have another word, please, as to the distinction between the body, the organic thought, and the other suggestion of the man and the woman, the two entities? I would like to be clearer as to that.

SMcC Well, we have the thought in the body of an organic link with Christ, the body is animated by the life of its Head; but that is not exactly the thought of the man and the wife. Union is linked with the thought of the man and the wife, not exactly with the body and the head; although the thoughts are so closely related that it is difficult to distinguish. But union in Scripture, as presented from Genesis to Revelation, involves the woman coming to the man. Whereas, there is no journey contemplated in relation to the body.

AJG Is the body a kind of constitutional thought, that it is “bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh”? Is that what is in your mind?

SMcC That is it. The body is out of Christ in that sense. The idea of the body in relation to the Head does not involve a journey. The body is animated by the life of the Head, is quickened in that life; but when you have the thought of union, it is two personalities - Christ and the assembly, and the assembly is conducted to Christ where He is; she comes where He is and is united to Him.

AJG So that while you have God bringing the woman to the man in Genesis 2, is it not perhaps rather more filled out in Rebecca in Genesis 24? It says there, that “Isaac led her into his mother Sarah’s tent; and he took Rebecca, and she became his wife, and he loved her.” You get the fulness of the thought there?

SMcC You get the fulness of the thought in Rebecca. You do not get the thought of love in Genesis 2; not that it is not there, because the type would point to the great reciprocal relations between Christ and the assembly in love, but we have to wait till Genesis 24 to get the actual love that is linked with union.

JTS In chapter 4 we have “the head, the Christ, from whom the whole body, ... “ Would that be the one side? Then in chapter 5 we have, “that he might present the assembly to himself glorious,” Does that at all give us the distinction?

SMcC Yes, we see two lines of thought there, that help in regard to it. What does Mr. B, say himself?

CRB I am thankful for what has been remarked. I was wondering if it is true that the body is a subsisting reality here and now, through the baptism of the Holy Spirit. It says, “in the power of one Spirit we have all been baptised into one body.” That is in the Corinthian setting, the present, actual position; whereas, is union more linked in Scripture with the heavenly position?

SMcC It is important to see that union is always linked with the heavenly position in our dispensation. We cannot touch union except as we reach the heavenly position, and it is by the Spirit. We do not have union in Romans, we do not have union in Corinthians, we do not even have it in Colossians, although the germ and principle of it is no doubt in these letters, but we have to come to Ephesians for the full thought of union.

JM Is not that brought out in Genesis 24? Isaac must not leave the land, his bride must be brought to him where he is.

SMcC Just so.

ACSP In the same connection, is it not to be noted that Abraham, in answering the question as to what would happen if the woman was not willing to follow the servant, says, “Jehovah the God of the heavens” would see to all that?

SMcC Very good, impressing us with how God comes into the matter. So that following all these references as to the assembly’s links with Christ in the headship, chapter 2 gives us really the journey in one way from the divine side (Rebecca gives it to us from our side), “But God, being rich in mercy, because of his great love wherewith he loved us, ... has quickened us with the Christ (ye are saved by grace, ) and has raised us up together, and has made us sit down together in the heavenlies in Christ Jesus,” Well, all that involves that we are brought to where Christ is; and God has done it, as it says later on, “We are his workmanship.” God has come into the matter in view of the consummating of His thoughts in regard to the expanse.

APB Could I ask why, in the end of Ephesians 1, the administration is connected with the assembly as Christ’s body; whereas in Revelation 21, the administration is connected with His wife?

SMcC It is John’s way in contradistinction to Paul’s. He identifies the city as the Lamb’s wife, the Lamb bringing on to view the suffering side in our thoughts, the Person who suffered, and the wife bringing on the sympathetic side. The body in Ephesians does not exactly bring in the suffering side, but the wife, as linked with the Lamb, does show the sympathetic link with that line. The administration is working out on that line, as we have it in type in Chronicles in relation to Solomon, the throne of ivory. That is, the administration is working out from the standpoint of the suffering.

HMH Would you say a word, please, as to the setting in time of the end of chapter 1? Does it particularly refer to the day of display, in the millennium, or does it carry on through into eternity?

SMcC We cannot limit verse 23 to what is provisional;

it involves what is eternal. The headship in verses 21 and 22, of course, particularly has in mind the millennial scene, but verse 23 involves the eternal scene, as well as the millennial scene, in the sense that throughout all eternity every impulse of Christ towards the universe will be through His body, the assembly.

CMM Do you link verse 22 with “Let them have dominion” in Genesis 1?

SMcC Exactly. We have had the thought of dominion and rule linked with the sun and the moon and the stars, which is a co-relative line of the truth; but what we are engaged with now is what particularly brings in the thought of feelings and affection. The influences of Christ and the directions of Christ are not working out arbitrarily to the universe, they are working out through a vessel that is His fulness, that is the expression of His feelings and His affections.

JM Is that why in this prayer Paul prays that we should be enlightened in the eyes of our hearts? Are not the affections involved in these great thoughts as well as the intelligence?

SMcC I thought so. I thought there was in this section a gathering up of the passages that we have considered together. We have “the administration of the fulness of times,” the heading up of all things in the Christ, the things in the heavens and the things upon the earth; and it links with what is in mind in Genesis 1 in the expanse. Then “the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory” links with the call of Abraham, and the separating of Abraham to heavenly hopes as we have referred to it, and as J.N.D. says of the hopes: ‘that suit the majesty and the love of Him that calls us.’ That is what we are impressed with in this section, the Abrahamic side, the heavenly calling involving sonship, involving heaven. Then the latter part of the chapter is working out to what we have in Revelation when principalities and powers are subjected to Christ and the city along with Christ influences the age.

DWG May I ask again for a little more help on verse 23, “the fulness of him who fills all in all”? I am thinking of the scripture in 1 Corinthians 15, “That God may be all in all,” which we understand to be eternity.

SMcC Yes. Say a little more.

DWG I am enquiring for help. I have been interested in what you have been saying as to verse 23 of Ephesians 1 not being limited to the millennium but going on into eternity. I am just wondering how that works out in view of the scripture in Corinthians where God is said to be all in all.

SMcC I think the expression in Ephesians 1: 23, “who fills all in all” is to remind us of the greatness of the Person that is before us here. It is to remind us of His deity, although what is said of Him is said of Him as the exalted Man; for the assembly is united to Him as the exalted Man. The whole bearing of this section from verse 17 to the end is man and God. Man in the exalted position as seen in Christ. Yet we have this reference to His deity, because only of One who had part in Deity could that expression be used, “who fills all in all.” But the assembly is not united to Him as God; the assembly is united to Him as the exalted Man.

JTS Would you say a Word as to chapter 4: 10 please, “He that descended is the same who has also ascended up above all the heavens, that he might fill all things”? What would that convey to us?

SMcC You get all things there, you do not get all things in Ephesians 1: 23.

JTS I am thinking rather of the Person.

SMcC Ephesians 4 is thinking of the system. The expression “that he might fill all things” has in mind the vast system of things that Christ has His place in relation to, as the exalted Man. That expression also involves His deity in that He has ascended up above all the heavens. But in Ephesians 1: 23 it is “the fulness of him who fills all in all.” Now it is not said that God fills all in all. In 1 Corinthians 15, in regard to what was referred to, it says, “that God may be all in all.” In Colossians we have the thought that Christ is everything, and in all. God is not said to be everything, and in all, but Christ is said to be “everything, and in all.” And God is not said to fill all in all, whereas Christ is said to fill all in all. And Christ is not said to be all in all. God is said to be all in all, in the coming day; the “all” is the all of supremacy. All these variations help us as to what is involved.

JMcK Does it bring out the great feature of instrumentality. God operating through Christ and through the assembly?

SMcC That is what is in mind, ‘Filling’ is an illuminating word; there is no thought of filling in 1 Corinthians 15. You have the thought of what is full in 1 Corinthians 15, but not the thought of filling. That is, it is the supreme “all” in 1 Corinthians 15, but in Ephesians 1, it is “who fills all in all.”

GEE Would this touch of Deity in verse 23 in relation to Christ, also help to elevate in a glorified way, the thought of the assembly though a creature as nearest to Deity?

SMcC It does. Because this is not said of Israel; it is not said of the angels, nor of any other family. It should thus help us to see the greatness that attaches to the assembly in this light.

AH Is the thought of equality in your mind in the matter of the body’s relation to Christ?

SMcC Just so. That is why I alluded to the type in Psalm 45, where you have got the full thought of equality in the queen, “upon thy right hand doth stand the queen in gold of Ophir.” That bears on what we have here, and the same with the woman builded by God in Genesis 1. There is no thought of any disparity, no thought of any lower status in regard to the position; the assembly is equal to Christ as Man in the exalted position.

AWGT Is that why Mr. Taylor referred at one time to horizontal love as related to Christ and the assembly in this scripture?

SMcC Yes, in the relation of union it is not a question of vertical love, it is a question of horizontal love between two persons in the position or status, speaking reverently and guardedly, of equality.

FWT Did not Mr. Coates use the expression of the assembly in this way as subject to Christ, but with no thought of inferiority?

SMcC Well, chapter 5 shows that the assembly is subject to Christ; but we do not have the thought of the assembly, in Ephesians 1, being like the authorities and the dominions and the principalities subjected to Christ. That is, when it says, “and has put all things under his feet” the assembly is not included in that.

RGB So in the word “gave him to be head over all things to the assembly,” the preposition ‘to’ is important there, is it not?

SMcC It is, it illuminates the whole matter. The headship of Christ is thus towards the universe through the assembly. It is what His headship is towards the universe through the assembly.

ACC Would you allow for the distinctiveness of Christ, that the assembly as His body is a matter of derivation; whereas there is not that thought with the Lord personally? Will there ever be a distinctive place with Christ personally, while there is this oneness in nature and status?

SMcC Whatever position you may view Christ, you must always make room for His uniqueness, and this added word, “who fills all in all,” is just to bring that in. But we should not bring the thought of subjection into this scripture in relation to the assembly, because the assembly is not viewed as subjected to Christ in this passage. We have got to take the scriptures in their context, in their bearing, and see how finely things are defined. In chapter 5 the assembly is said to be subjected to the Christ, but here, it is the equality of the assembly’s status with the exalted Man, in the administration of things towards the universe.

CH So that the question of equality relates to status and not to what is personal?

SMcC That helps to elucidate the thing.

CH Did not Mr. Raven say that the fulness is not so great as the thing itself? So that the particular place and personality of Christ is guarded in that He fills all in all.

SMcC So that what we have been dwelling on in regard to equality has to do with this matter of status. Because when you come to Christ’s personal greatness that always must stand by itself in its uniqueness; but in the status here, and the assembly’s position with Christ in the headship, there is no thought exactly of any under position. She, because of her greatness, is on equality with Christ as the exalted Man. The great thing to see, in regard to the subject that we are considering, is the way that the assembly is in this unique position. We are not only to think of it objectively, but we are to think of its bearing on us now and the saints universally in this wonderful link which the assembly has with Christ. So that things that transpire in one part of the world affect other parts of the world. It is the most wonderful thing that it is possible for us to apprehend.

GHSP Does this wonderful link of chapter 1 enter into the reference to the knowing the love of the Christ in that final section of chapter 3?

SMcC I think it does. You will notice that there is a distinct link between the two sections, in that it is said of the love of the Christ, that it “surpasses knowledge.” It is another link like “who fills all in all.” We are reminded of the greatness of the Person.

ECM In chapter 1 we have “the fulness of him,” that is Christ; but in chapter 3, “that ye may be filled to all the fulness of God.” Would you say a word about that?

SMcC In chapter 1 it is the fulness of the exalted Man. We love to think of His humanity in the gospels, how wonderful it is! This letter alludes to “the stature of the fulness of the Christ.” But to think of the fulness linked with humanity, or manhood, in the exalted position is a wonderful thing, and the assembly is the fulness of the exalted Man. But when we come to Ephesians 3, “the fulness of God” alludes to the outshining of God; the assembly could hardly be the fulness of God. The fulness of God will be seen shining out in Christ, not in the assembly, although the assembly is filled to it.

AH Does the thought convey the special measure that the assembly has as the most glorious vessel connected with the divine system?

SMcC I think that is what is to weigh with us. In designing the expanse and having in mind to make room for His great operations, there is no doubt that God had in mind Christ and the assembly, and the place that they would fill. It is a wonderful thing when you take account of it in this way, that of God it is said, Whom the heaven of heavens cannot contain. Yet our Lord Jesus Christ came into manhood and He was competent for the fulness of the Godhead to reside in Him; all the fulness was residing in Him. Think of the greatness of that thought! And then when we come to the thought of the assembly, and the greatness of Christ’s manhood, the assembly is great enough to be the fulness of Christ as Man in the exalted position. These are wonderful thoughts.

WGJ Is the use of the expression “the heavenlies,” intended to impress us with the vastness of the expanse into which we have been brought?

SMcC I think it is. And the references to the body of Christ in that relation are to show that geographical distance means nothing to us.

LWT So that in each of these passages we have the reference to “all the saints.” Is that to enlarge us in our thoughts as to the universal position?

SMcC Just so. I mean in regard to distance you can go home and get on the telephone and you can talk to Australia and you can talk to America. Well, people say, That is wonderful! But does it impress us sufficiently as to what is infinitely more wonderful, that there is a vessel in the assembly, in which there is living contact with every part of the world. Not by letter, not by correspondence, but a vessel, the body of Christ, animated by His life, as quickened in it; and the impulses of that linked with His direction as Head affecting every part of that vessel.

RGB Does the Spirit have a peculiar place and glory in relation to that and its maintenance?

SMcC He has. It has always affected me that in the moral universe, the features of which are brought before us in Ephesians 4, the first item that should be mentioned is the body. It says, “There is one body.” And then you get “and one Spirit.” While that has a provisional bearing, in relation to the moral universe, yet it is a wonderful thing to take account of this fact, that while the Spirit has not become incarnate like the Lord Jesus (the Lord Jesus became incarnate, He came into human form; the Spirit has not come into human form), yet He has a vessel in which His presence is as actually felt as the presence of Jesus was felt when here amongst men. That is a wonderful thing, that the Spirit is linked with the body. I think, while we often speak of the honour that God has accorded Christ in giving Him the assembly, it is a wonderful thing for the Spirit, that the Spirit is in the body which He formed by His coming and in which He has got uninterrupted liberty.

FAB Is what you are saying amplified in chapter 4? You have that in mind, no doubt; but I was thinking of the expression “its self-building up in love.” It does not so much refer there to Christ, but to the body as being a vessel capable of building itself up in love. Is that right?

SMcC That is what it says. It all impresses us with the greatness of this organism. The organism is a wonderful thing, and we need to be more and more conscious of it. I am sure we do.

JMcK Could we ask for some more help as to this matter of the fulness? In chapter 1 you are stressing that it is in view of the whole universe being affected, but in chapter 3, did you say that it is connected with the outshining of God, “filled to all the fulness of God”? In chapter 1 it is a stated matter but in chapter 3 it appears to be a process.

SMcC It is a complete matter in chapter 1, but it is a matter in process in chapter 3, which brings out the skill and refinement of divine operations. The strengthening inwardly, “in the inner man,” would suggest the great formation in the assembly; then we have, “that the Christ may dwell through faith in your hearts,” and then, “to know the love of the Christ which surpasses knowledge.” It is all entering into this matter, “that ye may be filled even to all the fulness of God.”

JMcK The three Persons entering into the matter.

SMcC All the three Persons entering into the matter, which shows us what a prime matter it is, especially bringing out the greatness of the assembly’s formation and capacity.

JMcK Now, will you tell us what is the objective in chapter 3? I think we have seen something of the objective in chapter 1, but what is the objective in chapter 3? Is it God-ward?

SMcC It is God-ward. It is the service of God, the praise and worship of God being in mind. What must it be to Deity to have a vessel into which there has entered the operations of every one of the Persons of the Deity! What must it be to them to see such refinement that there is such an answer towards God that affects all the families, as is in mind in Ephesians 3?

WWS Would the objective be in any way set out in that word, “to him be glory in the assembly” and so on?

SMcC That is what we are referring to; it is the God-ward side.

CRB I was just going to refer to the principalities and authorities in the heavenlies. It would be helpful, would it, if you would just say a word as to the place they have had in the expanse and what they now see in this glorious vessel?

SMcC When you go down through the ages and think of what was seen in Israel and especially what was seen in Davidic and Solomonic times, the marvellous glory and resources and wisdom that there was in Israel, the principalities and authorities have no doubt taken account of all that in their observance. But now something has come on to their view which amazes them, as I understand it; so that it is said of them, in regard to the assembly that is formed in this dispensation, “in order that now” - the word ‘now’ is to be noted - “to the principalities and authorities in the heavenlies might be made known through the assembly the all-various wisdom of God.” So that while the expanse has been invaded by evil influences and evil power, yet principalities and authorities in the heavenlies are seeing now how God is working towards the clearing of the expanse of all that, in matters that work out in the assembly.

GHSP Would it be right to say that the invasion of the expanse and all the moral exercises that have resulted from that bear on this word ‘depth’ which comes into the end of Ephesians 3?

SMcC I think it would. It is a remarkable word as it comes in here. We have been referring to the height as linked with the divine domain in the passages that have come before us. But in this passage, we get this added touch of depth, and how much enters into that, as we think of the dip between the two eternities, the dip down into time and all that has come into love’s ways, as divine operations have proceeded according to the divine pattern.

CH And does it suppose that the measurements are taken from the centre? In Revelation 21, to which we referred yesterday, they are taken by an observer, but here it would seem the observer takes his level as from the centre.

SMcC That is very interesting. We are in the very centre of the divine domain here, as the Christ, the Centre of it, is dwelling through faith in our hearts, and we look out upon the whole domain, and the measurements are from that point of vantage. It is not, as you say, an external view of it; it is an internal view out to the great scope of the divine domain.

CH Does it not enhance the particular place that the assembly has of association with Christ, and the intelligence that marks that vessel, that she is able to apprehend, at least, the four dimensions from the position in which she is found?

SMcC I think it does. It is not only, you might say, from the standpoint of chapter 1 that she is looking out on the universe as the vessel of Christ’s fulness and thinking about what that means to the whole universe; but here, she is looking out from the centre on the whole divine domain with the great God-ward result in mind, that the section contemplates.

RGB Is that supreme evidence of divine wisdom and love and power, that not only is there a vessel that is suited to have part in rule and influence, but a vessel suited for the response to God in fulness in affection and feeling?

SMcC I think that is the point. It is interesting to see in that relation the difference between chapter 3 and chapter 1. In chapter 1 you work out from the richness of the family setting into the great broadened sphere in the universe of rule and administration in connection with the headship of Christ and the assembly. In chapter 3 you work in from the thought of administration into the great centre of the divine domain, with a view to the result God-ward, where there is such richness and refinement of feeling that belongs to the assembly’s formation.

JMcK In chapter 1 is the universe somewhat before God, but in chapter 3 is God the Centre of all?

SMcC He is.

“Our God the Centre is,
His presence fills that land,” (72:2)

aptly describes it.

JTS You stressed earlier, in regard of the being filled, that it is “to all the fulness of God,” not ‘into.’ Perhaps you would say a little more to help us on that.

SMcC I think it is helpful to see the preposition ‘to,’ that we are brought up to it, filled to it; so that there is not a want in any one of our souls. The fulness of God represents the outshining of Himself in Christ. Well, we might say, That is far beyond us! No, it is not! Although we are marked by creature capacity and understanding, through the majesty of divine operations we are filled to it, so that there is no sense of a lack in the presence of it. We are completely satisfied and at rest in the presence of what we know to be infinitely beyond us.

AJG I think Mr. Taylor has referred to the fact that we know the love of the Christ which surpasses knowledge, as that which holds us in the presence of this immensity of thought, so that we are not lost in it.

SMcC Just so. It has a great steadying effect. The first night we were in Doncaster we were looking at the thought of the Christ in the epistle to the Ephesians. It is an interesting thing how much is made of the Christ. While He is officially the divine Operator, I am sure there is more in it than the thought of the official Operator, because it says, “and to know the love of the Christ.” In operations we do not generally think of love and affection in the operator, but I think it is brought in here to give a unique touch.

AJG Do you think it not only includes the known love of the Christ for the assembly, which the assembly enjoys, but also that we are impressed with the love of the Christ for the Father entering into all His movements?

SMcC Just so, and the love of the Christ for God, for God is Christ’s God, and we are to remember that. There is the perfect answer of man towards God in Christ, and He says to the overcomer in Philadelphia, “I will write upon him the name of my God.” I think the love of the Christ would have a bearing that way as well as towards the assembly.

GMS Reference is made in the scripture to Christ being “at his right hand in the heavenlies.” Is it not touching to think of this great subject of the expanse, and the Lord as Man in this wonderful place in it?

SMcC It is. We are to be impressed with the majesty that is linked with that side of things. Hebrews uses a unique expression, it speaks of “the greatness in the heavens,” Hebrews 8: 1. It all links together.

KFS It says who “has made us sit down together in the heavenlies in Christ Jesus,” Does that convey the thought of being at home in the expanse?

SMcC It does. That is, we are at home in the presence of divine dove and what divine love has reached and we are restful in it. We are no strangers to it, we are restful in the scene.

LWT Does the last Psalm give us an impression as to how this response is to fill the universe, beginning at the centre and widening out to everything that hath breath?

SMcC It would. I think “Praise God in his sanctuary; praise him in the firmament of his power” or “the expanse” is a remarkable reference to the inner side and the outward side. We have been speaking about the two sides. The firmament is the great expanse linked with the outward side, while the sanctuary is the inner position, you might say, where God particularly dwells; and there is praise in both spheres.