READINGS ON EZEKIEL (5)
[p. 246] READINGS ON EZEKIEL (5)
Ezekiel 20: 33, 34; Ezekiel 24: 15 - 27
JT In our last reading we dwelt chiefly on chapter 16, and what I think was noted was that that chapter refers to Jerusalem and the system set up in relation to it; for the covenant was made with it; but this chapter 20 treats of the whole nation. It is said, “It came to pass in the seventh year, in the fifth month, the tenth of the month, that certain of the elders of Israel came to enquire of Jehovah, and they sat before me”. Those responsible in relation to the whole nation of Israel came to enquire of Jehovah, and the passage read shows that the covenant is also treated in that relation, so that we have, I think, a suggestion in chapter 16 of a privileged part of the people of God. Jerusalem stood for a certain privilege as compared with the whole nation; God never loses sight of the whole of His people, although a certain section of them may be privileged. There are certain sections of Christendom that have been peculiarly privileged, and correspondingly come in for peculiar judgment on account of those privileges, the privileges being disregarded; but then God never gives up the whole. He has got the whole sphere of Christendom in His mind, the eastern branch as well as the western and its later subdivisions. I think that this chapter may be taken in connection with the whole responsible sphere, and God calls attention to the fact that although they came to enquire there was no virtue in that. In verses 3 and 4 He says, “I will not be enquired of by you. Wilt thou judge them, wilt thou judge, son of man? Cause them to know the abominations of their fathers, and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord Jehovah; In the day when I chose Israel, and lifted up my hand unto the [p. 247] seed of the house of Jacob, and made myself known unto them in the land of Egypt, when I lifted up my hand unto them, saying, I am Jehovah your God”. He goes back to the beginning of the nation’s history.
FL I suppose the fact of the matter was that the elders in approaching Ezekiel had no moral formation at all. Do you think that the Spirit of God, in taking up the past history of the fathers, would put upon the elders that they come burdened with all that the fathers had indulged in, the guilt of which they had accepted by a process of self-judgment?
JT Yes. So that you find in the history of the assembly as a responsible body, that the leaders at different times accept a certain responsibility, but there is no judgment of things from the beginning. The assumption of these leaders, or elders among the saints, and the part acceptance of the obligation that goes with it is not enough. God said he would not be enquired of by them. Things had to be gone into more thoroughly.
FL I suppose the point of view we get here differs with Christendom in its ideas, since with all the varied leaders there are in it, the remnant itself is not in view here.
JT Not until the end. There are those who accept responsibility, and in a certain way recognise God, especially when heresy lifts up its head, but that will not do. Things have to be really dealt with. God will not support any mere surface measures, and so He refuses to be enquired of; but then, what is so beautiful is, He undertakes the matter Himself. In verse 33, He says, “As I live, saith the Lord Jehovah, verily with a [p. 249] mighty hand, and with an outstretched arm, and with fury poured out, will I reign over you”. God asserts His rights; and whilst men disregard the rights of God, there is no use in attempting [p. 248] to enquire of Him. There has to be a recognition of the rights of God in Christ before God will hearken.
FL So that at this point it is: “Our God is a consuming fire”, Hebrews 12: 29.
JT He comes in in His own way. He says, “With a mighty hand, and with an outstretched arm, and with fury poured out, will I reign over you ... and I will bring you into the wilderness of the peoples, and there will I enter into judgment with you face to face”. So that God is in this chapter asserting for us, in a prophetic way, that He will not be enquired of by the responsible leaders of Christendom on their terms. He will be enquired of on His own terms, which involves that His rights must be acknowledged first.
AFM The thread of Israel’s history is taken up, as you were saying, from Egypt right to the point of time of the elders coming to Ezekiel. I suppose there would be no response to their inquiry until they cover all that period in self-judgment?
JT I think it really is a spiritual allusion to what exists in Christendom. That is, there is spiritual wickedness in high places. What marks the worship of God now is high places. There are places that are marked off as high, such as consecrated buildings. These are of no moral value, but the contrary. Now God will come in, but on His own terms, in the assertion of His rights in Christ; so that it says, “Let every one who names the name of the Lord withdraw from iniquity”, 2 Timothy 2: 19. It is thus He will come in and bring about deliverance.
BTF Is that an individual or collective thought?
JT Separation from evil is individual. The passage read shows how God comes in in the assertion of His rights. As things are outwardly, we might conclude there was weakness with God, but He allows things to go on, in His own wise way, but when He comes in it is in power; as it says here, “With a mighty hand, and with an outstretched arm, and with fury poured out, will I reign over you”. That is, He asserts His rights, and shows He has power to enforce them, so that deliverance from captivity can only be brought about by the acknowledging of those rights; as it says, “Let every one who names the name of the Lord withdraw from iniquity”.
DMR In connection with “Bamah”, do you think the ‘cathedral’ of today would answer to the high places in the land?
JT Yes. Christianity has been turned into a worldly religion. Whereas at the outset there was an acknowledgment of the rights of God; these have been set aside, and those who occupy the high places are totally indifferent to God’s rights; but what God is looking for is the man that humbles himself and trembles at His word.
FL So that verse 37 would suggest 2 Timothy 2.
JT It is the chastening, the discipline and the government of God; these are a necessity; but beyond these activities lies the bond of the covenant. We see what leads up to that; “I will bring you out from the peoples”, which for us would be the religious organisations around us. “With a mighty hand and with an outstretched arm, and with fury poured out; and I will bring you into the wilderness of the peoples”. Notice that; it is not the wilderness of Sinai as of old; but that of the peoples. The peoples will have become that to Israel.
FL I suppose that characteristic would answer to the movement in Ezra and Nehemiah; but spiritually it would involve the workings of God in the last eighty or ninety years.
JS Going back to the elders, why have they to go back to the beginning of the nation’s history?
JT You see, this book is full of dates, which have reference generally to the captivity. In the book of Revelation, I think we have our dates.
[p. 250] We go back to Ephesus, to the time of first love; the intelligent student of chapters 2 and 3 of that book can determine the date in which he is. Now when you arrive at that, you are not simply personally responsible to the Lord for what exists in that particular date, but you accept responsibility for what exists as a whole. The prophet John was to write what he saw in a book and send it to the seven assemblies; so that there would be the acceptance of obligation in regard to all by each one in the assemblies.
AFM The acceptance of personal obligation would take place first, you would say; for no one would seek the path of separation unless he had judged himself in relation to the system to which he was attached.
JT That is how it comes about: “Let every one who names the name of the Lord withdraw from iniquity”. We withdraw severally, but then God is working with each individual, and we are all brought into the wilderness of the peoples, as having judged the evil of the whole.
FL It is very interesting, the line on which you are directing us. They are carried back to the beginning. All through it was a movement of the mass, but this exodus is a discriminating one, so that there is an expulsion of the rebels. There is a division of the moral elements in this second exodus drawing out from the people. From Egypt they came en masse, and similarly early in Acts, but following the line of the address to the seven assemblies, as time goes on it is a discriminating movement marked by separation from evil.
JT Each one comes under His name, and as naming the name of the Lord I withdraw from iniquity, and so it goes on, “And I will enter into judgment with you face to face”. That is. God is dealing with us directly.
JS [p. 251] But you accept the present humiliating conditions in Christendom.
JT Yes, you feel responsible for them all. It would take in the whole area. You have in this section two sisters, viz. Jerusalem and Samaria; chapter 23. Well, there are divisions in our own dispensation corresponding to them — the eastern and western branches of the assembly, and they are both guilty, one possibly more than the other, because the western branch had more privileges, and so the guilt is greater, but the believer, as he submits to the rights of God, is exercised about all that. You see you are not indifferent to what is in the east any more than to what is in the west.
ARS Do I understand you to say that “I will bring you out from the peoples”, means Egypt?
JT No, for Israel the reference is to the nations in which they were scattered. For us the peoples are the world. The word is, “I will bring you out from the peoples”; that is to say, different nations in which they have been scattered. And again, from the countries. It is not what they were as captive in one nation in Egypt. Transferring the thought to ourselves, the people of God are found in different human organisations of the east and the west, and God proposes to take all His people out of them.
ARS “Into the wilderness of the peoples”.
JT Well, I think that means, that however fine these organisations may be, they now become a wilderness to you spiritually. You have not got anything in them. If you go into those places, you would find yourself away from home.
ARS Why does He bring them into this wilderness?
JT It is that you may realise that it is a wilderness. It is a question of your state of soul. Once, you were quite at home in those places but now you are away from home in them, because they lack family [p. 252] conditions. The remnant cannot sing the songs of Zion in a strange land. You awaken to the fact that those places are strange; home is in the circle of the saints, where the rights of God are taken account of, where His purposes are known, and where family affections are enjoyed. That is the homeland of the saints. All other organisations are the wilderness; and God would have you to feel that they are such.
ARS Well, did Naomi feel them to be such?
JT Yes, and returned to Bethlehem.
CAM Would you say that the people Peter addresses, as scattered, would be a sort of type of what you are speaking of?
JT Well, you see, Peter is addressing the saints of the dispersion. They were already owned as the people of God, and by God. “Ye are ... a holy nation, ... who once were not a people, but now God’s people”, 1 Peter 2: 9, 10. This does not go quite so far. We are dealing here I think with the individual exercises of the saints as God works with them. You are made to feel that the organisation with which you may have been, is now a wilderness to you, for there are no family affections there. God says I am going to speak to you face to face; He Himself adjusts us. I may say, I wish to come into fellowship, but God would say, that previous associations and conduct have to be adjusted.
AFM I think it is very important, not only in respect of ourselves, but those who are seeking to walk with us, that this adjustment should take place.
JT And so it says, “Like as I entered into judgment with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so will I enter into judgment, saith the Lord Jehovah. And I will cause you to pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant”. These are serious matters. He speaks with us face to face, and causes us to pass under the rod.
JS [p. 253] In order that we should do the will of God.
JT The rod reminds all of us that we are sons. It represents the authority of God to lead us into the covenant. The rod is used in love. “Whom the Lord loves he chastens”, Hebrews 12: 6.
JS Unless we feel the terrible conditions prevailing publicly we would not desire to stand apart from them.
HPW I was going to ask in connection with the rod whether there is the thought of the authority of God, not generally, but to me, as I pass under it there is the sign of ownership.
JT That is good. You see the masses of Christendom run into the millions, but, “Let Reuben live, and not die; and let his men be few”, Deuteronomy 33: 6. A ‘few’ can be easily counted. The saints are precious in the eyes of God; they are not taken account of in crowds, but one by one; they are very precious to God; every one is precious as purchased by the blood of Christ. I think, as you suggest, we all come under the rod, that is to say, God deals with us personally, not en masse, but one by one; He forms us in love, so that we might come into the bond of the covenant.
JS How about the rebels coming in after?
JT You will always find in a movement of God a lot will come in that is extraneous, and He has to deal with it. You will find that it always happens, but the thing to see is that all of us have to be dealt with personally. As you pass under the rod you are taken account of in love.
HPW In dealing with God face to face the conscience must be exercised.
JT Yes, indeed. The conscience must be touched. “Search me, O God, and know my heart; prove me and know my thoughts; and see if there be any grievous way in me; and lead me in the way everlasting”, Psalm 139: 23, [p. 254] 24.
FL Second Timothy runs with this: “The Lord knows those that are his; and, Let everyone who names the name of the Lord withdraw from iniquity”, 2 Timothy 2: 19. This is individual, both in the knowledge of the Lord, and the moral response to the requirements of God’s nature.
ARS What is involved in the bond of the covenant?
JT You have now learned that God loves you, not only in the death of Christ, but in the way He deals with you. Nobody can take up the Lord’s supper rightly, save as under the discipline of God. There is no son received save as chastened. He scourges every son whom He receives. The idea of reception becomes very interesting. If I learn the meaning of the rod, then I shall know the meaning of the bond. I put out my hand and testify that I want to be in covenant with Him; in doing so I commit myself to Him.
Ques Would the prodigal son come in here? Being far away but returning and realising all that was in the House.
JT The embrace is what he gets, which means that he is made conscious that God loves him; but then, is it worth your while to enter into that bond? If I know the love of God, I want to commit myself to Him as in a bond.
AT Coming under the rod is individual, but in the bond do we not come into a circle?
JT You do. As you put out your hand in this sense you are in a circle of fellowship. In Luke the Lord brings in the idea of fellowship early, because He would have His people bound together. So we have His entering into Peter’s boat, and then the Spirit of God tells us there was a partnership. Peter, James and John were partners. The Lord intended to make them partners in a spiritual way, and so the Holy Spirit makes a comment on their boats. They [p. 255] were sinking: they had caught a lot of fish but their boats could not contain them. And having left all they followed Him. The business partnership they were in is disregarded and gone; they are now partners in what is spiritual.
CAM The boats had served a good purpose.
JT But now they were unable to contain the fish caught; they were sinking. Peter had had to do with the Lord earlier than that. The Lord had been into his house; now it is a question of a partnership; and so the Lord enters into Peter’s boat, because that represents the partnership. They finally drew the boats to shore, left all and followed Jesus. He had said to Peter, “Henceforth thou shalt be catching men”.
FL The boats will be wanted again in another day; they represent what is Jewish.
ARS The Lord says, “I will bring you into the bond of the covenant”, not merely, “I will cause you to pass under the rod”.
JT We do not do it ourselves; everyone of us would admit that it is God’s doing.
FL Would you not connect 1 Corinthians 10 with this: “The cup of blessing which we bless” (verse 16)? The bond of the covenant?
JT That is where we come into it. “We being many are one loaf” (verse 17).
AFM Going back to Luke: the point in connection with the partnership was to show that already the bond had been established.
JT They leave what they were in and follow the Lord. Partnership there is the same thought as fellowship. And then the Spirit of God goes on to show that there must be new bottles. Things must be wholly new.
JS The old material would not do, sinking boats and broken [p. 256] nets.
JT New wine and new bottles (Luke 6) is to show how the bottles were formed.
AT And after we are introduced into this fellowship: “Ye shall know that I am Jehovah”. Is that the point to be attained?
JT Yes. You come into a circle of things where God is known.
FL There is clearly a discrimination in what follows. Verse 39 says, “As for you, O house of Israel, thus saith the Lord Jehovah: Go ye, serve everyone his idols”, etc. As joined to idols He held them as lost; but then in verse 41 He says, “As a sweet savour will I accept you”. The house of Israel is looked at on the one side as joined to idols, and on the other side in moral accord with God, as a sweet savour.
JT Then, I think, what you see in these verses is that God brings us into elevation. We are not only brought into the bond of the covenant, the Lord’s supper, and all that, but in verse 40 He says, “For in my holy mountain, in the mountain of the height of Israel, saith the Lord Jehovah, there shall all the house of Israel serve me, the whole of it in the land; there will I accept them, and there will I require your heave-offerings”, etc. You see how we are brought into the mountain of the height of Israel. One would especially call attention to what God proposes, and to where He would lead us.
JS Is that the point of gathering?
JT You have the gathering, but there is the height of the mountain of Israel. There are the precious truths of Christ as relating to the assembly. A height for us spiritually. You have the high places of the religious world mentioned, but we leave all that.
AFM This height is in contrast to “Bamah”.
JT There are high places in the Old Testament: Habakkuk speaks of his high places. “He will [p. 257] make me to walk upon my high places” (chapter 3: 19); this refers to resurrection; and so here, God proposes to bring His people into the mountain of the height of Israel. It involves for us the whole of Colossians and Ephesians.
DMR Does it suggest that the highest form of truth would be enjoyed, as in the spirit of Philadelphia?
J.T. Yes, indeed!
AFM It is at this point that we are able to view the assembly as a whole, and also to see its ruin.
JT Having come to the mount of the height of Israel, you are in proper spiritual elevation; then it goes on to say, “In the land”, that is the homeland.
CAM Would it be right to think of the mount of Transfiguration in connection with that?
JT Yes.
HPW It says, “There shall all the house of Israel serve me”. That would bring you back to the faithfulness of God, and what He wrought.
JT You have here what corresponds with the whole assembly, from the divine standpoint, described by the Spirit (verses 39 - 44).
ANW The word ‘all’ is all-embracive, and “the whole of it” would express its unity.
JT So that Ephesians does not think of anything less than the whole, “until we all arrive at the unity of the faith”, chapter 4: 13. It is very strengthening to think that God is holding to His purposes, and that every one of those purposes shall come to pass; in view of which the state of the people is being judged.
FL Paul gives an illustration of that before Agrippa; “our whole twelve tribes serving incessantly day and night”, Acts 26: 7.
HPW I was thinking it is encouraging when things outwardly look exceedingly small, it is the end that counts, and it is so especially when once we [p. 258] realise that the Lord has control. It is not dependent on anything else.
JT Very good. We will pass on to chapter 24. Verse 16 reveals that we have something that is the delight of our eyes. He says, “I take away from thee the desire of thine eyes with a stroke; yet thou shalt not mourn nor weep, neither shall thy tears run down. Sigh in silence, make no mourning for the dead; bind thy turban upon thee, and put thy sandals upon thy feet, and cover not the beard, and eat not the bread of men. And I spake unto the people in the morning; and at even my wife died. And I did in the morning as I was commanded”. Now this is all for a sign. The question comes into one’s mind as to whether there are now those whom God can use for signs to indicate His mind. In Luke 7 the Lord has one in the position where the criticism and opposition was. He says, “Seest thou this woman?” There was one there that He could call attention to as representing something. She was a child of wisdom. It is one thing to have meetings like this and speak about the things of God, but it is another thing to be a person to whom the Lord can call attention. “Seest thou this woman?” (verse 44); and then He goes on to call attention to the evidences of her love.
CAM Various women in the Acts would serve as examples, also Philip the evangelist and Timothy.
JT Yes. Peter announces the principle when he says, “Look on us”, Acts 3: 4.
AFM Joshua’s fellows were men of portent, or signs; Zechariah 3: 8.
FL I suppose Ezekiel, being chosen as the sign, carried the force and meaning of his name as “strength of God”, so he would suggest that the sign must be supported in the sight of God before it could justify wisdom. It is a wonderful thought that one who is really established in the power of God becomes the justifier of God in this sign..
JT It is a very important point. “Ezekiel shall be unto you a sign; according to all that he hath done shall ye do: when it cometh, then ye shall know that I am the Lord Jehovah”.
CAM It would be applicable to us in the present day, not to take ourselves out of the line of the will of God.
JT Yes. So that John’s gospel hangs on this same principle that Ezekiel hangs upon, that is, on certain signs.
AFM What is “the desire of thine eyes”? How do you view that expression?
JT I think it would refer to those who have been taken up with the history of the assembly, but not from the spiritual standpoint, and who have ministered in these latter days. It would be how they regarded the history of the assembly, what it was to them; but nevertheless they had to leave it.
FL The most endearing thing.
JT There is the idea here of one having to give up without mourning what he was attached to. One can understand a pious man so regarding the historic church, and all that it stood for as dear to him.
FL In verse 25 there seems to be a contrast; “when I take from them their strength, the joy of their glory”. I suppose that the man of God remains as a sign when those things are gone.
JT Yes. The history of the assembly has come to that. There is much that they boasted in, but the Lord is outside of it all; He says, “Behold, I stand at the door and am knocking”, Revelation 3: 20.
WT It speaks of Ezekiel being no more dumb, but he was to speak to him that is escaped; to such the things of God are opened up.
JT I have no doubt that the Lord would remind us that we are not to be dumb if we are representing the truth in our ways; we are to speak about things to him that [p. 260] is escaped.
FL The suggestion of Laodicea is right. Verse 26 says, “In that day he that escapeth shall come unto thee”. The individual exercise in a Laodicean condition is attractive to God, and should one have something to offer, the exercised are directed to Him.
AFM Verse 25 clearly depicts the Laodicean state.
JT Just so. Then, “In that day shall thy mouth be opened”. I am sure there is a word in that for us.
WB-w Is he the sign in verses 16 and 17?
JT It is the way he acts in the light of this terrible calamity. He did not mourn.
HPW Do you not get a beautiful example in the Lord of the principle of the sign when asked who He was, answered, “Altogether that which I also say to you”, John 8: 25?
JT Yes, and as Paul said, “yet show I unto you a way of more surpassing excellence”, 1 Corinthians 12: 31. It is showing the thing.
CAM Showing it is not writing it down, it is being it.
JT Just so.