(3) THE TESTIMONY OF THE CHRIST IN 2 CORINTHIANS
(3) THE TESTIMONY OF THE CHRIST IN 2 CORINTHIANS
FER The point in 2 Corinthians is ministry. There is not much about ministry in the first epistle, which brings out more what God has been pleased to establish down here, but in this epistle the main point is ministry. The first six chapters are taken up with the apostle’s ministry, and great prominence is given to the ministry of the new covenant and the ministry of reconciliation.
In the first epistle the thought of Christ does not go beyond resurrection, but here there is an advance in the presentation of Christ. “Whatever promises of God there are, in him is the yea, and in him the amen, for glory to God by us”. Then in chapter 3 we get, “looking on the glory of the Lord”; and chapter 4 goes further, and speaks of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. If the light of Christ is thus brought in, it is in order to conform us to it.
Ques If the first epistle only goes as far as resurrection, what is the connection of the temple and the body?
FER The first epistle brings out what God has established here by the Spirit, the first principles dependent upon the presence of the Spirit, and that is an essential part of Paul’s ministry, if the Spirit is here the temple and the body are here. It is not taking into account the state of the saints, but what results from the presence of the Spirit. These are first principles in connection with the presence of the Spirit.
But when we come to the second epistle, the point is ministry, which is intended to affect the saints.
[p. 483] Paul brings in further light in the ministries of the new covenant and of reconciliation, and the object of it all is that the saints may be conformed to Christ.
Rem So the first epistle had done its work in preparing them for this.
FER Undoubtedly. They had to recognize the first principles in connection with the presence of the Spirit, and a very necessary principle to enforce in those early days of christianity was the holiness of the Spirit. You may depend upon it, that if people disregard the holiness of the Spirit, they will get no further light. Here the apostle was free to give them further light because they had repented and judged themselves. I am very confident of this, that people, that we, want first principles. It has struck me very much of late that we live far too much in appearances, and we need to get into realities. The foundation of all realities is the righteousness and holiness of God. We want a more real sense of what God is morally, and to be in accord with Him morally; if not, there is bound to be unreality. At the beginning there was no idea of keeping up appearances; Adam and his wife were naked and were not ashamed, but when lawlessness and impurity came in, it became necessary to keep up appearances. You get the idea in the fig-leaves; they made themselves aprons because they had consciences, and the world has lived in appearances ever since. People are not what they appear to be; appearances are kept up in a thousand ways. But we want to get into the region of realities, and to be in suitability to the righteousness and holiness of God. If you get back to first principles, you can afford to go in for realities, you can afford to be what you really are. The world is full of unreality; it appears pleasant enough to the flesh, but it is a world of unreality, and we have to find it out. The great thing for us is to get into the region of realities,
[p. 484] where all is based on the righteousness and holiness of God.
God has revealed Himself in righteousness, and it is to have its effect on us so that we depart from lawlessness. Lawlessness prevails amongst us to a large extent. If you are controlled and ruled by Christ, you are free from lawlessness; but for this there must be abiding in Him. “Whoever abides in him, does not sin”, 1 John 3: 6.
Ques Is not that what we desire to go in for?
FER Well, I do not see very much of it. People do what they like, and go where they like, and read what they like; but that is not abiding in Christ. The Spirit would maintain us abiding in Christ, and in that way keep us here for God’s will. You never find people moving to a worse locality, they move to a better one, and do it as a matter of course; but the question is, what is suitable to Christ? Is Christ merely a name or a doctrine to us, or is He the sun and centre of all to us?
Rem But I thought we were beginning to get on a little bit.
FER Well, I should be very thankful to see the marks of it. I would like to see self-denial, and a real interest in the testimony of Christ.
Ques Might not lawlessness enter into service even?
FER Undoubtedly, it may enter into anything. I was speaking of it in connection with our getting into the region of realities. We need to be built up on the righteousness and holiness of God; the apostle exhorts the saints as having put off the old man, and having put on the new man, which according to God is created in truthful righteousness and holiness.
Ques Does the apostle’s ministry in 2 Corinthians come in to this end?
FER Yes, I think so; it is to lead us into the practical displacement of flesh that the Christ may [p. 485] be everything. The effect of the ministry of reconciliation is that the old man is practically displaced, and Christ is everything, so that “if any one be in Christ, there is a new creation” (chapter 5: 17).
Rem And new creation is what is for God.
FER Yes, it is what is of God and for God, so that God has complacency in the work of His hands. When God created the heavens and the earth, He “saw everything that he had made, and behold it was very good”. New creation comes in that there may be a man in whom God is complacent.
The first elements of the gospel do not go beyond the death and resurrection of Christ. The gospel is defined at the end of Luke, “thus it behoved the Christ to suffer, and to rise from among the dead the third day; and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name to all the nations beginning at Jerusalem”, Luke 24: 46, 47. All that is based on the death and resurrection of Christ, and is taken up in 1 Corinthians 15, but when we come to the ministry of the new covenant, it carries us on to the thought of the glory of the Lord.
Ques What is the thought of the glory of the Lord?
FER To my mind it is like what the sun is in the physical universe; all the glory of the physical universe is centred in the sun; the planets shine simply by reflected light. I know no better illustration than this, and it is one the simplest person can understand. What the sun is to the physical universe, Christ is to the moral universe; He is the Sun of righteousness; all the glory is in Him, and He sheds the light of His glory upon all that come into that universe. We need to get into the light of Christ; it is a great thought that He is the centre of that universe. We know something about the physical universe, but what we need to know about is the [p. 486] moral universe, and the glory of it. All the glory of God is there, and Christ sheds His light upon every family. I suppose the planets would represent different families, and every family will reflect the glory of the Lord. You remember what it says in Isaiah 60: 1, “Arise, shine! for thy light is come, and the glory of Jehovah is risen upon thee”. Israel will come into that moral universe, and under the shining of that light; the glory of the Lord will rise upon her, and she will reflect it.
Rem We come into the presence of the glory of the Lord now.
FER Exactly; we already form part of the moral universe by the work of the Spirit. The glory has its own proper effect, and we are changed into the same image, from glory to glory, as by the Lord the Spirit. We have come into the shining of the Sun, and the glory of the Lord is risen upon us. We get in this way a knowledge of the new covenant. The new covenant is like the sun in the heavens; the sun is God’s covenant in regard of man, it is the pledge of the mercy of God to man; men get the benefit of God’s sun all over the face of the earth, and it is the witness of divine goodness. Rain is dependent upon the sun, for without the sun there would be no rain; the moisture is evaporated by the sun which comes down in rain. The Lord gives a hint of all this when He speaks of their Father in heaven making His sun to rise on the evil and on the good.
If you take up the Pentateuch, you get the thought of the ark of the covenant and the mercy seat. The new covenant is the expression of God’s will towards man. The righteousness of God is the rights of His mercy, witnessed to by the law and the prophets.
Ques What is the connection of the first five chapters as to the thoughts [p. 487] of ministry?
FER The points as to ministry which the apostle takes up are very essential. You get the new covenant, which is God’s disposition towards man, and then reconciliation. In Luke’s gospel we come to the good Samaritan before we come to the prodigal; we have to go on bit by bit. The ministry of reconciliation was committed to Paul, and then the man in Christ is caught up to the third heaven; that is the moral effect of the ministry.
Ques Do we not get three different thoughts in Luke’s gospel in chapters 7, 10 and 15?
FER In Luke 7 you begin with the gospel, the knowledge of God’s mind towards man. Then chapter 10 brings Christ into view; it is the appreciation of what Christ is; He is everything to you. Then in chapter 15, it is what you are for God. You must learn what God is for you before you can learn what you can be for God. In the new covenant I learn what God is for me, but in the ministry of reconciliation I learn what I am for God.
The righteousness of God is towards all men. “When they had nothing to pay, he frankly forgave them both”, Luke 7: 42. The mind of God is exactly the same in regard of all men; it is the forgiveness of sins. “He is the propitiation for our sins; but not for ours alone, but also for the whole world”, 1 John 2: 2. A man could have no possible right to stand before God if he did not see that. Then you learn how Christ can come in and bind up your wounds, and pour in oil and wine, and set you on His own beast, and take care of you. Christ is really dispensing the grace of God. But the prodigal goes a step further, and learns what he can be for God; he is for the Father’s complacency and pleasure. We cannot reach this before we learn the other. If people do not know what God is for them, how can they know what they can be for Him? Someone wrote to me the other day, saying that he found many [p. 488] people who had not peace with God; but what I feel is that people may have peace with God simply as a creed, and have very little gain in their souls. The great thing is to have the knowledge of God, and that is the lack in souls.
Rem The knowledge of God settles every difficulty.
FER Yes, it settles everything. People think they have to arrive at a certain point, and then they will have peace with God; but the real thing is to learn that God has peace with you. You must arrive at what is in His mind; and if you know that peace is in the mind of God for you, you have peace with God, and you cannot have it in any other way.
Ques Does Luke 23: 43, illustrate the twelfth chapter of this epistle?
FER Not exactly. Paul went up to the third heaven that everything might be confirmed to him; he was in the good of what he ministered, and he was caught up to heaven to receive confirmation of everything in view of his ministry. It was a special privilege accorded to him.
Ques Does not the thought of a man in Christ seem to be of one who is in the good of what is unfolded earlier in the epistle?
FER Everyone who is spiritual is in Christ, but a man in Christ is a man who is in the good of Christ.
Ques Could you not speak of the Corinthians as being men in Christ?
FER No, not exactly. A man in Christ is not a babe but a man. It is no credit to people to be babes when they ought to be men.
Ques How would you help people to the knowledge of God?
FER It is not left to us; it is God who quickens souls for Himself. I would look to God that hearts might be attracted to desire His knowledge, every man for himself. Anyone who takes part in ministry [p. 489] ought to be much exercised in connection with his ministry.
Rem The apostle prayed that “the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the full knowledge of him” might be given to the saints (Ephesians 1: 17).
FER Yes, exactly, and we have to look to that, too. And this is so very important, because you cannot know anything apart from the knowledge of God. You cannot even touch the elements of christianity apart from the knowledge of God; you get the forgiveness of sins by knowing that it is God’s mind for you; well so far you have the knowledge of God.
Ques How would you say we know peace with God?
FER By learning that His mind is peace towards all men; you see it in Christ; He is the Sun of the moral universe, and everything that is for man shines in Him.
Rem I will “give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles”, Isaiah 42: 6.
FER That is a beautiful expression. We come through the forgiveness of sins to the teaching of the new covenant, and when the Spirit is given we begin to apprehend what God is for us as seen in the good Samaritan. Nothing can be more important than to see that faith apprehends what is general, by the Spirit we apprehend what is particular. The basis of the gospel is not substitution but propitiation, and that is for the whole world. Substitution is a truth appropriated by the Spirit; it is not general.
Rem We have to appropriate substitution; it is for me.
FER Yes, and that is by the Spirit.
Ques What scripture would you use to show that?
FER How do you think Paul said, He “loved me, and gave himself for me”? He said it by the Spirit. It is very important to see that we appropriate Christ by the Spirit, and only by the Spirit.
[p. 490] Ques Do we not sometimes try to give souls what the Spirit only can give them?
FER Yes, I think so. The only possible witness is the Spirit.
Ques In preaching the gospel, is it not well to show that the end before God is that men may receive the Spirit?
FER I think so.
Ques What is the end of God in the gospel?
FER That He may be known of men, and that men may find their stay and confidence in the knowledge of God. It is God’s pleasure to be known. Without forgiveness of sins a man could not have a good conscience in regard of God; he could not enjoy God if there were any uncertainty in regard to that. The gift of the Spirit is a means to an end, and the end is that God may be known in the heart of man.
Rem God could only be known as the result of divine teaching.
FER Yes, and that is where the new covenant comes in with the element of divine teaching. In the first epistle the apostle presses the first elements of the gospel, in the second he brings in the light of the glory of the Lord.
Ques Would not the incident of the ten lepers illustrate this?
FER Yes, I think so.
Rem The tenth leper was a christian.
FER Yes, representatively; he came back and gave glory to God. The nine pretty much represent christendom; people have received practical benefits by Christ, but they do not come back to Him that they might give glory to God. It is an acceptable time, a day of salvation, and men come into many external blessings by Christ; christendom is in a certain sense cleansed — cleansed relatively; men [p. 491] have come under the influence of the kingdom, and have received benefits thereby.
Ques Is it something like Hebrews 6?
FER Yes; only it has not quite come to apostasy yet.
Rem It is beautiful to see how God secures His tithe in the one leper.
FER Yes, God will have His tithe.
Rem If we only preach the relief side of the gospel, we shall get converts like the nine.
FER Yes.
Rem It is said that only makes more work for the teachers.
FER I do not know so much about that; people are greatly affected by first impressions. It is a very serious thing to preach the gospel; I do not think a novice ought to attempt to do it. One must be instructed in the knowledge of God’s disposition towards man to enable him to preach the gospel. It is a fact that the apostles did not take to the work of the ministry very young, and it says of the Lord Himself that He “began to be about thirty years of age” before He commenced His public ministry. I think all that has to be regarded. A man has no right to preach anything he does not know. People think they can preach the whole of Scripture; but my thought is that no man ought to preach anything but what he is in the good of spiritually himself. “We speak that we do know”, the Lord said; and I think the principle holds good for us (John 3: 11).
Ques Do not some people learn much more quickly than others?
FER I do not know. I do not see people learning very quickly.
Ques What about the man out of whom the demons were cast? He went and published [p. 492] it abroad.
FER No one could object to one converted going and telling his friends what the Lord had done for him.
Rem And he himself was the witness of what he preached.
FER Yes, but I think he would have been wiser if he had kept within the words of the Lord, “Go home to thy friends, and tell them”, Mark 5: 19.
You must know the Person you preach. To set forth the attitude of God towards man, you must be acquainted with that attitude. You cannot present the new covenant except as you are in the good of it yourself. You might find one who could preach very well from Luke 10 who could not touch Luke 15. It is a wonderful thing to have Christ before us as the Sun and Centre of the moral universe — the perfect setting forth of God’s disposition towards man.
Ques “The light of the knowledge of the glory of God” is His moral effulgence, I suppose?
FER Yes; it is how God shines according to His mercy. The knowledge of God is according to His mercy, administered in righteousness. Mercy came in consequent upon the law being broken, and though the righteous requirements of the law are now fulfilled in those who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit, yet their knowledge of God is according to His mercy. That is the wonderful thing to my mind; God is glorified in regard to the law, and in regard to His mercy. We do not know God according to law, but according to mercy. The truth is that the new covenant has come in by a Man; it has come in by Christ, and the law was within His heart, but He was the perfect expression of the mercy of God, and He appreciated the mercy that He expressed. We take our colour from Christ; and God is known of us according to His mercy. Who of us could stand before God in respect of the law? But our knowledge of God is according to His mercy.
[p. 493] Rem It is beautiful that He appreciated the mercy He expressed.
FER The Lord took up our infirmities that He might be the Vessel of the mercy of God, but He appreciated the mercy He expressed.