HEAVENLY CALLING AND CHARACTER
HEAVENLY CALLING AND CHARACTER
AJG In the twenty-fourth chapter as we had last week, Isaac is, of course, a type of Christ, but in this chapter Isaac typifies the believer as having been called with a heavenly calling, and as here in testimony in the midst of influences that would tend to rob him of his true character, as heavenly. And therefore it is a question of Isaac knowing how to get the full gain of what God had given him, and to move here consistently with it. The chapter opens with the thought of a famine, and that becomes a test. A famine becomes the occasion for God to tell him not go down to Egypt. His father before him had done that, on the occasion of the previous famine and there had been sorrowful consequences. So here, Jehovah warns Isaac not to go down to Egypt but to dwell in the land. He says, “Sojourn in this land, and I will be with thee and bless thee.” So that Egypt is the first thing that has to be overcome or refused by Isaac, and he obeys the divine injunction; and from that time onwards it is a question of the Philistine and the influences of the Philistine that have to be overcome by Isaac. There might be a famine in our own souls, that is to say, a lack of spiritual food and nourishment, and that becomes a test as to whether we are going to resort to what is in character, Egypt, or whether we are going to come under the influence of what is in character, Philistine. Egypt is not Sodom and it is not Babylon. There are three great outstanding types of the world in scripture: Sodom and Egypt and Babylon. Sodom is the world as marked by gross evil, and Babylon is the religious world in which man can glory and obtain glory, but Egypt is just the world as a system where man lives to himself and pleases himself, and does not live to God: and we are warned in John’s epistle not to love the world or the things that are in the world. That is, we are tested sometimes as to whether, while maintaining separation from the world as a system, we are going to bring in the principles of the world into our own lives.
HLH Are these conditions of famine allowed purposely by God to cause us to learn to overcome those influences and elements?
AJG I think so. First Egypt and then the Philistine, which is the most insidious, opposing element, and one needing to be constantly overcome, because it is a question of getting into the gain and actual possession of the wealth of what God has given us.
HLH So that if we do have at times a sense of barrenness in our own souls, it can be turned to good account?
AJG It can, if we pay heed to the word. What is seen in this chapter is that Isaac does obey the word and does not go down into Egypt, so that he overcomes that danger; but then the next paragraph shows that he comes under the influence of the Philistines, and denies his wife. But then he is apparently recovered from that, and from that time onwards he learns the secret of spiritual prosperity. That is, he sows in the land and receives an hundredfold the same year, and then he is diligent in digging wells. First digging wells that had been stopped up, and then digging fresh wells. So that the latter part of the chapter is marked by spiritual energy on Isaac’s part which is rewarded. But the first part shows certain influences that he is in danger of. The second part shows that there are influences opposed all the time but he overcomes them.
EMs Would you tell us what the Philistine element represents?
AJG The Philistine element is always the effort to compass the things of God with the energy of the natural mind, and that is a thing which comes close home to us all. It is full-blown, of course, in the clerical system around us, where education and training are regarded as all that is necessary to take part in the things of God; ignoring what scripture says, that the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness unto him (1 Corinthians 2: 14), but then the Philistine element comes closer home than what is around us in the religious world. It is a constant danger with us all of attempting, by mental energy and activity, to get into the things of God.
HLH So in whatever degree we may come under the power of these influences we will lose the power that is available to us in the Spirit?
AJG That is the whole point. It is a question of spiritual things being entered upon in the Spirit, and moved in in the Spirit.
JS Would you say that we need to listen to the voice in connection with Egypt?
AJG We do, and we have got the voice - “Love not the world neither the things that are in the world.” We have got the voice and hence we are to listen to it, and particularly at any time when there are famine conditions, because that is the time when we are in danger of turning aside to something that is going to accentuate those conditions rather than improve them.
LBr When you say famine conditions, you mean famine conditions amongst us?
AJG Yes, or in one’s own soul. It is possible to have famine conditions in one’s own soul in the presence of great spiritual plenty.
JS I was thinking of what goes on in one’s soul and the voice that is to be adhered to. It says, “Let my son go that he may serve me,” and “out of Egypt have I called my son.” Would that be a voice?
AJG Yes.
AY The famine conditions in one’s soul would be borne out in the book of Ruth where there was a famine there in the land, and Naomi left the ‘house of bread’ and went down into the land of Moab and there were very serious consequences, but eventually there was recovery?
AJG Yes, quite so, and there was no doubt something governmental in that, owing to the general state of things, because it was in the days when the judges ruled, when everyone did what was right in his own eyes. But then on the other hand Boaz was there in Bethlehem, the mighty man of wealth, and his fields were there; they were all there. When Naomi came back and Ruth with her, she found plenty.
AAT Do you think that the twenty-sixth chapter follows the twenty-fourth, because of the way that the 24th has opened up in connection with the service of the Spirit, and the wells are stopped to try to offset the teaching of the 24th chapter?
AJG Yes, I think so, I think the 26th chapter comes in in order to stimulate us to enter upon and lay hold of all that God has given us. We have got the light of Christ and the assembly in the 24th chapter, which is connected with God’s great thoughts of love concerning us, but now we want to enter upon them in power and understand them and enjoy them. And so He says, “Sojourn in this land.” The land is just the whole thing that God has given us in His love.
HOE What corresponds now to Isaac denying his wife?
AJG Well, he said she was his sister, that is, he did not repudiate her altogether, but it is like maintaining the family side of the truth, that we are children of God and love one another, and get on very well together, but we deny the assembly. The assembly is distinctively heavenly, and it is a question of letting go the heavenly features of the truth, getting along very happily on the family side of things,
that we love one another, but denying the distinctively heavenly character of our calling. The assembly is united to Christ in heaven, and is heavenly.
WH Would you say he was forewarned in verse 3, “Sojourn in this land, and I will be with thee,” said God? Had he kept to that he would not have denied his wife?
AJG Isaac was afraid he would lose his life if he confessed his wife, and that is what we have got to be prepared to do, we have got to be prepared to lose our lives if we are going in for spiritual things.
JHH Is that why the Lord told the disciples not to be elated because the demons were subjected to them, but rather that their names were written in heaven?
AJG Well, He would impress them with that, that they belong to heaven, they are known there, but then the danger is that, while in a sense rejoicing in the truth objectively, we are not prepared for the exercises involved to take it up and make it our own.
AY The Lord said in one of the gospels, “Whosoever shall desire to save his life shall lose it, but whosoever shall lose his life for My sake and the gospel’s shall save it” (Mark 8: 35). Would that have any connection?
AJG I think it would. It is a question now of the Spirit, and if we are to pursue the things of the Spirit we find that, in one way or another, it involves death. In Christianity life is always out of death.
AAT I notice how attention is called to Isaac, “The man became great, and he became continually greater, until he was very great.” Has that an application in connection with current teaching?
AJG Oh, I think it has an application, not only in connection with the teaching, but in connection with the appropriation of the teaching. That is to say, there may be an abundance of teaching, but if I do not appropriate it, I do not become great in a spiritual sense; but if I appropriate it and make it my own, I am all the time becoming greater spiritually. Not that we want to be occupied with ourselves as to whether we are great or not, but that is the fact, it was as the result of Isaac’s sowing in that land that he became great and greater still.
AT Referring to barrenness, in Peter’s epistle he speaks of “adding”. If these things abound in you, you are neither barren nor unfruitful.
AJG Quite so, there had to be the adding, “In your faith have also virtue, in virtue knowledge,” and so on.
LAC The multiplication here of Isaac’s seed is likened to the stars of heaven only, not to the sand by the sea-shore. I was wondering whether that was an intimation from God’s side of the heavenly character of things, and whether in His injunction to Isaac to remain in a land where there was a famine, God’s thought was that heavenly things would keep him above the conditions around him.
AJG Well, that is good. The stars of heaven stresses what is heavenly as you say, and what is heavenly in testimony, that is what it says in Philippians, “among whom ye appear as lights in the world, holding forth the word of life.”
AAT In connection with the Philistine, it could be one of the hindering elements in our understanding the teaching of the truth, is that right?
AJG Yes, it is a constant tendency with us, if one may speak for others, to attempt to compass divine things just by mental energy and activity. That is, reading ministry assiduously and speaking about it and thinking that we can compass it that way. Well, now, no one would say a word against reading ministry assiduously, but we can only understand divine things in the Spirit; we can only move in them in the Spirit; and that involves not only paying attention to the teaching, but it involves a good deal of secret exercise, and prayer, and dependence, and seeking the Lord, and being prepared to be searched as to anything that we are allowing that is hindering the operation of the Spirit. So that it is first of all a question of “sowing”, which means that you have to dig deep, and then it is a question of “digging wells”, which means that you have got to get rid of obstructions. All that enters into the chapter.
CBl Spiritual growth is in view in that way?
AJG Yes, exactly.
MSS It says in verse 1, Isaac went to Abimelech the king of the Philistines. Would that be the tendency you referred to, to turn to the natural mind and natural energy?
AJG Well, very likely. We read in the gospel about Zacchaeus, his trouble was that he was little of stature, and that is the trouble with most of us in divine things. And he thought he would overcome it by great energy, and climbing up a tree, and so on, but the Lord says, Come down; you are not going to arrive at things that way. He says, “Today I must remain in thy house.” He has got to start at the beginning and let the Lord have His place, and regulate him and so on.
TG Was Jehovah appearing to Isaac and speaking about Abraham to him, and what He had promised Abraham, to help him to overcome this Philistine element?
AJG Quite so, and God says to Isaac, “Because that Abraham hearkened to my voice,” He is really encouraging him by the example of those that had gone before him - his spiritual father, you might say. He was, of course, his natural father, but I mean, we are to be encouraged by the example of those that have gone before us.
SC We sometimes sing, “Who is a pardoning God like thee, or who has grace so rich so free.” In spite of Isaac going to the king of the Philistines,
in verse 2 we see the Lord appearing to him and speaking to him.
AJG Yes, I do not know that there was anything exactly wrong in Isaac going to the king of the Philistines, because Gerar was part of the land. He was not leaving the land to go there, the Philistines were there in the land. It only shows how very near the Philistine is to us, that he is in the land. Egypt is not the land. He was warned not to go down to Egypt, and he obeyed.
JHH It says, “And the men of the place asked about his wife.” Is that not very often a very great test to us, when men begin to inquire as to the truth of the assembly?
AJG And as to whether we are practically holding it, so that it is part of us. I mean, we are all tested as to how far we are really heavenly, not that we want to be occupied with ourselves or want to appear to be anything that we are not, only we are, in fact, heavenly, and the danger is lest we surrender what is proper to a heavenly people and take lower ground; we may be content with the family side of things and getting on very well and happily together. But then that may very easily develop into what is social, and may even lend itself to what is Egyptian if we are not careful.
CB Would you say that the apostle Paul was afraid of the Philistine element where it says, at Corinth, he was with them in much fear and trembling, and he determined not to know anything among them save Jesus Christ and Him crucified?
AJG I would, I believe he was very afraid of it, and hence he brings in the cross in order to make room for the Spirit.
EMs What do you think would keep us on heavenly lines?
AJG First of all, the light that we are heavenly, and that, not as connected with ourselves, but connecting it with the sense that the assembly is united to Christ. It is a great thing to keep Christ before us, and a sense of the distinctive place that the assembly has with Christ. But then as to our own side of things, and moving into them, the only thing that I can suggest is getting to God about things. Pray without ceasing, it says. That costs us a good deal more than sitting down and reading a book, but it is more effective in the long run.
Ques What do the names of these wells convey?
AJG The first thing is that there were certain wells which Abraham had dug which the Philistines had stopped up, and then Isaac re-dug them, and gave them the same names that Abraham had given them. That is to say, that as we take up the truth in energy in our souls, it is the same truth as has been known before. We do not attempt to give fresh names to things. If it is the truth of the body, we call it the truth of the body, if it is the truth of eternal life, we call it the truth of eternal life, and so on, but it is a question of getting it in freshness and power in our own souls.
LAC You mean, if scripture calls it “The Lord’s Supper”, we call it by that name?
AJG Yes, quite so. And before we come to the question of the wells there is the question of sowing. It says, “Isaac sowed in that land, and received in the same year an hundredfold; and Jehovah blessed him,” and then we get the verse that was referred to, following on that, “And the man became great, and he became continually greater, until he was very great”; so that raises the question as to where we sow.
MSS The word of God to Abraham would keep Isaac in constant dependence. It says, “Go not down into Egypt, dwell in the land that I shall tell thee of”, as though he did not become fully enlightened all at once.
AJG I think that is right. In Psalm 37 it says, “Dwell in the land and feed on faithfulness,” and that is a remarkable statement. I believe you could write that over this chapter - “Dwell in the land and feed on faithfulness.” I believe the Spirit of God is the great expression to us of the faithfulness of God, that notwithstanding all the departure from the truth that has marked the assembly in its public history, the Spirit of God has remained with us all the time and is now getting His place, because God is faithful and wants us to come into the good of all that His love has given us.
SP Is there a possibility, like Isaac here, of our not maintaining the truth of the assembly?
AJG There is, exactly. That was what was involved in his denying his wife. He would say that she was his sister but he would not say that she was his wife. That is, he denied union. He would acknowledge that she was related to him, we may acknowledge that we are born of God and of the divine family, and love one another, but would deny union. And that is the great thing, the distinctive feature that the assembly is united to Christ in heaven, and therefore is heavenly. We may be afraid of what men would do or think.
RS We would like to know just here what is the distinction or difference between union and unity.
AJG Unity is that we are all one, but union is the result of being united to Christ by the Spirit. But the saints must be united together in affection in the Spirit, so that there is one entity, before the reality of union with Christ by the Spirit can be known. And hence the importance of unity among ourselves, but that is not everything. That is essential, but then the distinctive feature of the assembly is that by the Spirit, she is united to Christ, she is His wife to be with Him in everything, and therefore she is heavenly.
CB What is the thought of sowing?
AJG Well, if we sow to the flesh, we shall of the flesh reap corruption; if we sow to the Spirit we shall of the Spirit reap life eternal, so that it is a question of what we sow to, where we sow, the direction in which we sow. It is very much a question of what we give our minds and time to.
LAC There seems to have been no Philistine attack until the sowing begins and the fruit is seen, then the attack seems to be threefold; firstly, envy, and the effort to stop the wells, and then the final expression of hatred, on the part of the king himself.
AJG I think that just shows that there is this element hindering, or opposing, all the time, but the one who has really got the heavenly calling in his heart, will just go on quietly with the Spirit.
HLH But it would be a suggestion that, as Isaac sowed he would have felt the need of the waters that the well would provide, to aid him in his sowing and to bring fruit out?
AJG Yes, I am sure of that, but it is as though as soon as he sowed God honoured him, because it says, he received in the same year a hundredfold, and Jehovah blessed him, as though, Isaac having now arrived at that, that the answer to the famine is to sow, and to sow in the right place; God at once rewarded him.
BBSnr Why is it that people marked by envy are in possession of this land?
AJG You might ask why envy is found in the heart of a Christian, but it is found there, alas; sometimes. We always carry the Philistine with us, and the only thing to do is to see that he is judged in the power of the Spirit.
RAE Would the fact that is says, in the same year he received an hundredfold, be to impress us that as we begin to move on these spiritual lines we find God near to help us?
AJG That is it, I am sure, and we get the same thing later on in the chapter, it says in verse 24, “And Jehovah appeared to him the same night,” when he went up to Beer-sheba, and then again in verse 32, “It came to pass the same day”; as though three times in the chapter God would give us the sense that He is pleased with Isaac in the movements that he is making and encouraging him in them.
EMe And would “the year” too, suggest that the exercise was carried right through?
AJG That is so, you mean having to face all the different seasons? Quite so, because God has ordered different seasons, all with a view to promoting fertility.
AKH Why does the matter of his wife, and the exercises connected with it, have to be gone through before the sowing is entered upon?
AJG Well, I have no doubt that it would come home to Isaac what he had done in denying his wife, and the danger connected with it, and God had graciously delivered him; that would all enter into his exercise now to proceed on right lines. If I am afraid to take up the ground of being heavenly, well I ought to get to the Lord about it. But I am heavenly so why should I be unprepared to be concerned, at any rate, to walk in keeping with it?
AKH Does it indicate in any way the idea that what we might prosper in individually is in view of contributing to what the assembly stands for in relation to Christ?
AJG Yes, quite so. I suppose the greatness that marked Isaac, when it says, He became great, and he became continually greater until he was very great, is simply a question, for us, of increase of spiritual power. And then it goes on to speak of the substance he had, possessions of flocks, possessions of herds, and a great number of servants; so that he developed in spiritual substance as well, and all that would be material for sacrifice. He had a great number of servants, that is, he was developing in serving love really, in the Spirit of Christ; the idea of servants was greatly accentuated with him.
LBr What would be the thought then of the Philistines stopping all this up with earth?
AJG There is one thought connected with sowing, but another connected with wells. Sowing is a question of the exercise undertaken with a view to fruitfulness, which only God can give, I might sow with great diligence, but unless God gives the increase there will be nothing, so that it only impresses one with one’s dependence. However much I sow, if God does not give the increase there is nothing in it. So that while you have got to sow, it forces dependence on you.
WH And from the time he sows, Jehovah blessed him, but the Philistines envied him.
AJG Yes, the Philistine will envy, because we all recognise, when a brother has spiritual wealth and spiritual liberty, that he is greater than anyone who has mental ability and brings it into the things of God.
EM A brother referred a little while ago to the water, his wells being very essential, having sown. And even that is dependence, because the Spirit is God, it is God Himself here.
AJG Yes, quite so. But then wells, of course, involve the Spirit Himself, as giving life and freshness, and they have to be dug, and they can be choked. The exercise of digging is just to get rid of what is obstructing, because in each well there is a fountain which springs up; but then the well has got to be dug in order to provide free course for the fountain.
CBl Whatever exercises we may have, we need to be dependent on the Spirit for this divine freshness?
AJG Quite so, exactly. To hold the truth in freshness so that we have really got it as our own in power.
MSS The word as to quenching the Spirit in Thessalonians - would what is Philistine have that effect?
AJG It would, I am sure. We might quench the Spirit in many ways, we might quench it in ourselves or we might quench it in others.
AAT And we may quench it too when we are together assembly-wise?
AJG Quite so.
SC What would we learn from the servants digging in the valley in verse 19?
AJG We read first of all in verse 17 that Isaac departed thence and pitched his camp in the valley of Gerar, and dwelt there. And then they dig in the valley. That is a good place to dwell, as the note says, it is really a valley with a torrent running through it. So there is the combination of thought of what the valley suggests, in lowliness, and the power and freshness of the Spirit which the torrent suggests. It is a good thing to dwell there.
AY As a result of Isaac’s great substance, spiritually, as you have been saying, I suppose he becomes so great, applying it to us, that we would be in this world bearing a heavenly character in such a way, that the Philistines would say, Go from us; Do you not think that that would be a good thing for us?
AJG It would, quite so. The superiority of what is spiritual is recognised. But here first of all it says of Isaac that, “All the wells which his father’s servants had dug in the days of Abraham his father, the Philistines stopped them and filled them with earth.” But then it says in verse 18, “And Isaac dug again the wells of water, that they had dug in the days of Abraham his father, and that the Philistines had stopped after the death of Abraham; and he called their names after the names by which his father had called them.” That is, he is concerned to have the truth that has been known in the past, in freshness and life and reality. And so he takes up the exercise of digging so that he might have it in that way.
GHP Would the torrent suggest that which is unceasing in power, suggestive of the Spirit with us for ever?
AJG Yes, I would think so.
RAE Is there anything suggested in the wells being filled with “earth”, or as the alternative reading is, “dust”?
AJG Mentality in the things of God is as dry as dust.
RAE I wondered if it was really the nothingness of the first man? We have the same thought in Corinthians, have we not? “Such as he made of dust, such also those made of dust; and such as the heavenly, such also the heavenly ones.”
AJG Quite so.
LAC Are there not two thoughts here in the first section connected with the agricultural idea, in connection with digging and sowing, but here it seems that the wells and the water from them is needed for the flocks - the shepherds contend over them. Would it be the recovery of the truth in view of the flock, those to whom it belongs, the saints of God?
AJG Quite so, but I would not limit it to the thought of the flock, although as you say, it is the herdsmen or shepherds that contend, so evidently they are concerned about the water for the flocks, but the water is needed, of course, to water the land as well, it is needed all the way through. That is why the Lord is giving such prominence to the Spirit now, that we should all really come into the gain of the Spirit, so that heavenly things may be entered upon in spiritual intelligence and moved in in freshness and in power.
RS Is not the “earth” of which the wells were filled suggestive of the tendency with us to cleave to earthly things?
AJG Yes, I think so. We could quite well apply it in that way.
AAT Abraham’s wells seem to have been dug, but there are other wells, are there not?
AJG Yes, showing that there are continual possibilities open before us in the Spirit, first of all, to have what our fathers have known, to have it for ourselves in spiritual freshness, but then also to realise that there is still more, the Spirit has come to guide us into all the truth.
MSS The water in verse 19 is distinguished, it is called the well of “springing water”, or “living water”.
AJG That was the result of their digging in the valley. That is, it is not now a question of only digging to recover the wells that they had previously had, but they were going on digging.
Ques Might we not gain something from the fact this is in the land of the promise?
AJG And the land of promise is that which God has promised to His saints, the spiritual blessings in heavenly places, wherewith He has blessed us. But it is a question of our entering upon it so that we not only know that we have the title to these things, but that we can say something about them, and enjoy them, and move in them.
RS Is not the aspect of the Spirit there as the Earnest of the inheritance?
AJG That would enter into it, certainly.
CB Would you say digging wells is really making the truth our own. We can give account of things ourselves.
AJG Yes, and the exercise on our part simply consists in getting rid of what is obstructing, because the fountain is there, but the well has got to be dug, so that every obstruction to the fountain springing up has to be removed. So that there is free course made for the Spirit of God, and as that takes place, things open up in freshness. So the old things are known again in renewed freshness and called by the same names, and then there are fresh wells that have not been dug before. It is the constant wealth that there is in the Spirit.
FHP As we make progress too, would you say that we must be prepared for opposition? The shepherds strove with Isaac’s shepherds saying, the water is ours.
AJG Yes, exactly. There are two forms of opposition, first, stopping up the wells, and then they do not do that any longer, but they claim the wells, there is contention and they claim them. When any fresh feature of the truth is brought out, it is really opposed by the natural mind trying to take it on at once, and by doing so, robbing it of its freshness. But then that is met by the energy in Isaac to go on digging fresh wells. He simply goes on in energy with the exercise of making room for the Spirit, until he reaches a point that the Philistine cannot any longer contend.
CB So that the natural man cannot contend or keep up with the spiritual man at all?
AJG No, exactly. That is it.
CB Would you say the assembly is a heavenly vessel down here in testimony in the midst of all these tests?
AJG Quite so. Constantly beset by these tests, Egypt not far off and the danger of going there, when there is anything answering to a famine, and then the Philistine element always at hand.
CB So that we notice even in David’s day they became giants, and they had to defeat the Philistines right through.
AJG Yes.
HLH These shepherds who contended for the wells had no hand in the digging of them, it was Isaac’s servants who dug them.
AJG Quite so. And as soon as they had dug and brought to light a fresh well, then the Philistines come along and claim it.
HLH The contention and opposition was from the other side, and it is a question of how we carry ourselves in the presence of those conditions, I suppose.
AJG It is, exactly. It says, “The bondman of the Lord ought not to contend, but be gentle towards all,” it is a question of going on in the Spirit.
SP Would you say that at every fresh feature of the truth that is being presented, it is the point of the enemy to seek to hinder it?
AJG That is it, and if he cannot stop up the well with earth, he will try and hinder it by claiming it in his own power and in the spirit of contention, and as he does so he really robs it of all its freshness.
LAC There seems to be no direct intimation that Isaac surrendered the wells. There is the quarrelling and the striving, but do you think that it is to be noted, that although the enemy may attack, that is no reason for us to surrender the truth in any way?
AJG No, you do not surrender it, but it says, “He removed thence”, verse 22, “and dug another well; and they did not strive for that.” I think the thought is that the contention is just met by going on in the Spirit, realising that the Spirit will always open up fresh features of the truth to us. But what has been dug is not surrendered of course, but there is just this exercise of digging another well so that the truth can be held in freshness and in power without being questioned.
AY Would you say that we see that character developed in Paul especially at Ephesus, where he was often attacked but he was able in the power of the Spirit to maintain things and carry them through right on to the end?
AJG Yes, so that he had in the end, declared to them all the counsel of God.
MC Would you say that “Rehoboth” would suggest what was in the power of the overcomer?
AJG Well, it is like that in principle.
AAT So in connection with what the Lord is giving us, should we be looking for a new well?
AJG I think so. It is very encouraging that in the Spirit there is no limit to what God may show us. Not that we want to be on the line of novelties, or anything of that sort, we have to beware of that, but on the other hand the Spirit searches all things, yea, the depths of God; and He has been given so that we may know the things that are freely given to us of God.
MSS Would you help us as to the meaning of “Rehoboth” in soul history?
AJG Well, it means “Broadways” - that is, plenty of room. That is, the confirmation in one’s soul that the more we go on in the Spirit the more we shall find plenty of room, plenty of expansion in divine things, and also superiority over the natural mind. Spiritual things are not compassable by the natural mind, and that is why spiritual ministry often seems somewhat elusive in character, you cannot pin it down as you would natural things. It is because divine things cannot be compassed by the natural mind, they can only be known in the Spirit.
HOE Would this new well be keeping on positive lines? We do not turn aside to have an argument on things, we just keep on positive lines going on with the Spirit.
AJG Quite so.
SC Does Isaac make headway now from verse 22?
AJG Yes, it says, “And he went up thence to Beer-sheba.” Beer-sheba alludes, I think, to the faithfulness of God.
TG That would mean that if we maintain faithfulness, that God would appear to us and confirm us in the truth, so that we may overcome?
AJG Yes, and I think we get an increasing sense that God is faithful. The Comforter with us stresses His readiness to guide into all the truth, and it is a great witness to us of the faithfulness of God. You think of all that has come in in the public history of the church, and how the truth that was ministered by Paul was all given up - it is a wonderful thing if we are beginning to touch the truth in any degree, in recovery now. It is a witness to us of the faithfulness of God, and that shows itself in the abiding presence of the Holy Spirit.
TG That would help us to go on in the midst of all that is opposed in this faithfulness to God?
AJG It would indeed.
LBr And after a time the Lord might cause some to come to us, and desire to be with us, referring to verse 28.
AJG Well, what they said was not all true really, but still Isaac could afford to be gracious to them.
TG What would the altar that Isaac built in verse 25, be to us now?
AJG The altar refers to our private links with God. He built an altar there, that is, he had arrived at something in his soul. It is a very good thing if we arrive in our souls at a real appreciation of the presence of the Spirit of God and why it is that the Lord is stressing it at the present time. It is a witness to the faithfulness of God, and that He intends us to arrive at all the truth.
AAT Do you think the Spirit might open up something beyond Paul’s ministry?
AJG I doubt if anything would be opened up to the saints that was not opened up to Paul. This thought of digging wells is to be continued by us all the time, and the more it is resorted to, the more freshness there will be found amongst us. We cannot enter into the truth apart from the Holy Spirit, and that is what digging wells would mean. Verse 26 is a question of man’s power and influence and sociability and whether we are going to come under the influence of these things. Isaac shows them grace but he sends them away. Isaac is tested all along the way, and we are all along the line tested as to whether we are going to continue in the maintenance of heavenly features or whether we are going to fall under one thing or the other.
Finally we get Isaac tested as to this family, in Esau’s wives; it says, “And they were a grief of mind to Isaac and to Rebecca.” It is as though the enemy was all the while trying to hinder or divert Isaac and when he proved faithful as to the Spirit, the enemy was now trying to get in through his family. It shows by his grief of mind that Isaac was a man of feeling, but there is no suggestion of his making allowance for or condoning the matter. From verse 12 onwards God shows His approval three times by giving increase the same year, and appearing to him the same night, and by his servants coming the same day, and telling him of the water they had found.